EV (electric vehicle) News & Discussion

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#3260997 18-Jul-2024 11:39

the big battery version of ID.7 Tourer gets 685km WLTP rated range, which is fairly incredible.

https://www.volkswagen-newsroom.com/en/press-releases/electric-all-rounder-of-a-new-era-world-premiere-of-the-id7-tourer-from-volkswagen-18162

Easily beats the more thirsty petrol cars for range. (i.e. v8 mustang with a 60.5L tank and 13.L/100km economy = 462km)

"The largest battery is designed for a maximum charging capacity of up to 200 kW at DC quick-charging stations. At this power level, the battery can be recharged from 10 to 80 per cent in significantly less than 30 minutes."

Very impressive charge speeds from a 400v car. Good charge curve too. Staying above 50kW all the up to about 93%

Should note to get charging speed's north of ~150kW on a 400v platform car, one needs a fast charger with a 500 amp cable which is quite rare. Most higher power chargers have 400A cables, and some (like the one at mercer), have 200A cables, meaning only 800V platform cars can max out the charger.

Dingbatt

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#3264234 25-Jul-2024 11:03

I was just watching a few videos from the Aussie reveal of the MG Cyberster. Coming to Oz towards the end of the year, so I’d expect the same here.

I admit it’s a pretty nice looking car. Not so sure about the scissor doors beyond the “look at me” factor. As long as you have a decent height overhead where you park, I guess it would be okay. But they do add unnecessary weight and complexity. Seems like they’ve managed retain some space in the boot with the top folded. Reports are that although it has 3 driver display screens you can only see one of them due to the steering wheel.

To be clear, this is not a practical EV (2 seats, smallish boot, no frunk and acceptable range). It’s a weekend tourer to have a bit of fun in.

Then there’s the price. Quoted price for Oz (only the 2 motor variant available initially) is $100-130K (AUD). So $NZD120-150K with exchange rate and GST differences. The NZ distributor is quoted as saying they expect this car to “sell in the tens” and that it is a “halo product”. I’d suggest they may struggle to meet even that, at that price.

By comparison they are listed in the UK at £55K for the single motor and £60K for the dual motor (so $NZD120K and $NZD131K) which appears about right until you consider the extra taxes they pay. As well as that, a Model 3 Performance in the UK is £60K, it’s $NZD87K here. Even if you add a bit for the scissor doors and folding roof, they should still be selling here for less than $100K (and even cheaper for the single motor). It is based on the same platform as the MG4-Xpower, which sells for $70K.

Might be a tough sell when you can pick up a 2yo Audi e-Tron GT for $120K.

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Scott3

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#3264243 25-Jul-2024 11:56

Dingbatt:

I was just watching a few videos from the Aussie reveal of the MG Cyberster. Coming to Oz towards the end of the year, so I’d expect the same here.

I admit it’s a pretty nice looking car. Not so sure about the scissor doors beyond the “look at me” factor. As long as you have a decent height overhead where you park, I guess it would be okay. But they do add unnecessary weight and complexity. Seems like they’ve managed retain some space in the boot with the top folded. Reports are that although it has 3 driver display screens you can only see one of them due to the steering wheel.

To be clear, this is not a practical EV (2 seats, smallish boot, no frunk and acceptable range). It’s a weekend tourer to have a bit of fun in.

Then there’s the price. Quoted price for Oz (only the 2 motor variant available initially) is $100-130K (AUD). So $NZD120-150K with exchange rate and GST differences. The NZ distributor is quoted as saying they expect this car to “sell in the tens” and that it is a “halo product”. I’d suggest they may struggle to meet even that, at that price.

By comparison they are listed in the UK at £55K for the single motor and £60K for the dual motor (so $NZD120K and $NZD131K) which appears about right until you consider the extra taxes they pay. As well as that, a Model 3 Performance in the UK is £60K, it’s $NZD87K here. Even if you add a bit for the scissor doors and folding roof, they should still be selling here for less than $100K (and even cheaper for the single motor). It is based on the same platform as the MG4-Xpower, which sells for $70K.

Might be a tough sell when you can pick up a 2yo Audi e-Tron GT for $120K.

here is a video on it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M9hGUn0WKng

Interesting play by MG / SAIC.

The scissor door's kind of indicate the the car is being positioned as a cheap supercar, appealing to the look a me crowed. But the key question is such a market willing to buy a car from a brand which is know for having cheap car's.

Assuming it is not a track weapon, being a 2 seater, convertible with cool doors is it's pretty much only selling point. If a buyer can accept a sedan, the Model 3 Performance is faster, has longer rated range, and is dramatically cheaper (but is also more common than a Camry these days).

Personally I think MG would have been better targeting the Mazda MX5 style of car, and stripped everything back in the interest of weight savings (ditch AWD, Fancy doors, big rims, make it smaller etc), such that they could sell it for similar price as the MG4 x power.

Suggest there should be a heap of margin in the cyberster. Many parts (incl the battery) are common with the much cheaper MG4.

And they do have the advantage of having no direct competitors in the market. If one wants a new sports car style convertible EV, this is the only product on the market. For some who love convertibles this will be worth the price tag.

We had a convertible (vw beetle) as a rental car on one holiday. It was quite fun, and I see how some people would be willing to pay a steep premium for a convertible.

richms

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#3264247 25-Jul-2024 12:52

Scott3:

The scissor door's kind of indicate the the car is being positioned as a cheap supercar, appealing to the look a me crowed. But the key question is such a market willing to buy a car from a brand which is know for having cheap car's.

Assuming it is not a track weapon, being a 2 seater, convertible with cool doors is it's pretty much only selling point. If a buyer can accept a sedan, the Model 3 Performance is faster, has longer rated range, and is dramatically cheaper (but is also more common than a Camry these days).

Halo products. Audi was only known for boring shyteboxes before the R8 came out.

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#3264249 25-Jul-2024 13:01

How do you pronounce the name? Cyber-stir, or Sy-burster?

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deepred

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#3264293 25-Jul-2024 15:54

Dingbatt:

I was just watching a few videos from the Aussie reveal of the MG Cyberster. Coming to Oz towards the end of the year, so I’d expect the same here.

I admit it’s a pretty nice looking car. Not so sure about the scissor doors beyond the “look at me” factor. As long as you have a decent height overhead where you park, I guess it would be okay. But they do add unnecessary weight and complexity. Seems like they’ve managed retain some space in the boot with the top folded. Reports are that although it has 3 driver display screens you can only see one of them due to the steering wheel.

To be clear, this is not a practical EV (2 seats, smallish boot, no frunk and acceptable range). It’s a weekend tourer to have a bit of fun in.

Then there’s the price. Quoted price for Oz (only the 2 motor variant available initially) is $100-130K (AUD). So $NZD120-150K with exchange rate and GST differences. The NZ distributor is quoted as saying they expect this car to “sell in the tens” and that it is a “halo product”. I’d suggest they may struggle to meet even that, at that price.

By comparison they are listed in the UK at £55K for the single motor and £60K for the dual motor (so $NZD120K and $NZD131K) which appears about right until you consider the extra taxes they pay. As well as that, a Model 3 Performance in the UK is £60K, it’s $NZD87K here. Even if you add a bit for the scissor doors and folding roof, they should still be selling here for less than $100K (and even cheaper for the single motor). It is based on the same platform as the MG4-Xpower, which sells for $70K.

Might be a tough sell when you can pick up a 2yo Audi e-Tron GT for $120K.

Also, can MG shake off the "Chinesium" stigma? Mind you, the original British MG wasn't all that flash either in its later years.

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deepred

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#3264297 25-Jul-2024 15:56

richms:

Scott3:

The scissor door's kind of indicate the the car is being positioned as a cheap supercar, appealing to the look a me crowed. But the key question is such a market willing to buy a car from a brand which is know for having cheap car's.

Assuming it is not a track weapon, being a 2 seater, convertible with cool doors is it's pretty much only selling point. If a buyer can accept a sedan, the Model 3 Performance is faster, has longer rated range, and is dramatically cheaper (but is also more common than a Camry these days).

Halo products. Audi was only known for boring shyteboxes before the R8 came out.

The original Audi Quattro broke the mould.

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ech3lon

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#3264594 26-Jul-2024 10:13

Scott3:

here is a video on it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M9hGUn0WKng

A longer review by Matt (carwow):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=olcjaZYaUvY

My takeaway is the only downside from the car seems to be the drive experience is a bit lackluster, could be improved by suspension tuning maybe?

alasta

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#3264629 26-Jul-2024 11:44

deepred:

Also, can MG shake off the "Chinesium" stigma? Mind you, the original British MG wasn't all that flash either in its later years.

I have a colleague who has experienced a few annoying quality issues with his Chinese MG, but it's nothing like what you would have experienced under British Leyland.

ilovemusic

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#3264800 26-Jul-2024 21:15

Forget the Cyberster.

You want a 1300hp Yangwang U9

😂

johno1234

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#3265938 29-Jul-2024 17:13

The pendulum swing away from BEV has gone so far that they are becoming cheaper than hybrids. I find that hard to explain.

A 2022 Tesla MY typical price 2nd hand now around $47-$50k

a 2022 Toyota RAV4 up-spec hybrid > $50k ?

Yet the Toyota has more to go wrong with it, and is very low tech by comparison. Do people not like high tech? Wary of charging and range?

HarmLessSolutions

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#3265992 29-Jul-2024 17:40

johno1234:

The pendulum swing away from BEV has gone so far that they are becoming cheaper than hybrids. I find that hard to explain.

A 2022 Tesla MY typical price 2nd hand now around $47-$50k

a 2022 Toyota RAV4 up-spec hybrid > $50k ?

Yet the Toyota has more to go wrong with it, and is very low tech by comparison. Do people not like high tech? Wary of charging and range?

Batteries, which are reducing in price fast, make up a large proportion of the cost of a BEV whereas that proportionality is much reduced in a hybrid which still includes an ICE in its manufacturing input. Combine that with the price war occurring between Tesla and the Chinese brands and it's probably not surprising that parity has been reached in not only BEVs vs hybrid but also BEV vs ICE soon, if not already in some markets.

https://www.harmlesssolutions.co.nz/

alasta

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#3265995 29-Jul-2024 17:58

johno1234:

A 2022 Tesla MY typical price 2nd hand now around $47-$50k

a 2022 Toyota RAV4 up-spec hybrid > $50k ?

Yet the Toyota has more to go wrong with it, and is very low tech by comparison. Do people not like high tech? Wary of charging and range?

Some people like tech and some don't. I am in the latter camp, so would opt for the Toyota which I would consider to be more familiar and conventional.

jarledb

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#3266064 29-Jul-2024 22:39

alasta:

Some people like tech and some don't. I am in the latter camp, so would opt for the Toyota which I would consider to be more familiar and conventional.

Any new car is going to have a lot of tech in it. Including Toyota. So if you don't want tech you will have to stay with older cars. It is not as much a BEV vs ICE as a modern car vs old car thing.

For instance: Driver monitoring that has become one of the points in the Euro NCAP test, and regulations have also added speed limit warnings that will alert you if you go above the speed limit.

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gzt

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#3266115 29-Jul-2024 22:58

RAV4 hybrid is a very successful model. Toyota keep resale value for good reasons. You're not exactly comparing apples to apples.

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