TV died on us after about 3 weeks of use, What are our options?

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#807553 29-Apr-2013 16:42

KiwiNZ: [snip]

I did answer your bold with "The retailer can propose that and the consumer can reject it."

Fair enough... Clearly then every major retailer in the country doesn't understand the act...

http://www.consumer.org.nz/reports/consumer-guarantees-act/putting-it-right

"If the problem is minor, and can be fixed, the retailer can choose to either repair, replace or refund."

A blown capacitor or broken power switch could render a TV unusable, but is a minor, fixable problem (my example).

http://www.ns.org.nz/21.html

"Putting it right
If something goes wrong, you have the right to insist that the seller fixes things.

Generally speaking, this means the retailer who sold you the goods or services must sort out the problem. If the stitching comes apart on your fairly new shoes, you do not have to track down the manufacturer or importer, you simply take them back to the shop. If they tell you the shoes were never much good, it is their problem, not yours.

However, if you have trouble with the seller, you also have the right to get the shoes fixed elsewhere and claim the cost from the seller. But before you do this, you should try to sort things out with the initial seller. If you get nowhere, tell them - preferably in writing - what you are going to do, and keep written records.

If the problem can not be fixed, or can not be put right within a reasonable time, or is substantial, you can:

Reject the product or cancel the service contract and claim a full refund or replacement. Sellers can not offer a credit note only. If you want cash back, you are entitled to it.
Alternatively, consumers may claim compensation for any drop in the value of the product or service, or claim for any reasonably foreseeable extra loss that results from the initial problem. If your new washing machine does not go properly, you can claim for laundry costs or for the cost of hiring a replacement one while the first one is being fixed."

http://www.consumeraffairs.govt.nz/pdf-library/publications/Your-Consumer-Rights--Goods.pdf

"what is the Consumer Guarantees Act?If the problem is minor the trader must provide a remedy of repair. Or thetrader can choose to replace or refund.If the problem is major, you can reject thegoods and choose between a refund orreplacement. Or you can keep the goodsand seek compensation for the reduction in the value of the goods.In most cases which remedy you are entitledto will depend on how serious the problem iswith the goods, and whether you are seekinga remedy from the trader or manufacturer."

http://www.cab.org.nz/vat/consumer/goods/Pages/Gettinggoodsfixed.aspx

"If the good is faulty (i.e. if you didn’t cause the problem) and the problem is minor the retailer can choose between repairing the goods, replacing them or giving you a full refund. If there is a major problem you can return the goods and demand a replacement or a complete refund."

http://www.business.govt.nz/laws-and-regulations/consumer-laws/retailers

"Remedies provided under the Consumer Guarantees Act include repair, refund or replacement of goods and the cancellation of services."

http://www.turnerhopkins.co.nz/news/consumer-guarantees-act-70/

If a defect is discovered in a good or service, and it is relatively small, the retailer can choose to either repair, replace or refund the affected good or service provided the fault is remedied within a reasonable timeframe. If the defect cannot be restored in a timely manner or the defect is substantial, the consumer has the right to reject the product or service.

And I'm out.

Cheers - N

Please note all comments are from my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.

networkn

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#807557 29-Apr-2013 16:50

PaulZA: Thank guys for the replys. Upon reading this, I got my mother to contact their head office to verify if all what they said was correct, and they said it was their company policy if the product died after 7 days, to send it off for repair, instead of replacing it or refund.

We just want our money back, we have lost all faith in the brand, and we're starting to loose faith fast in the warehouse.

I don't understand why, you have an issue and they have agreed to fix it. Just because you WANT a refund, doesn't make that a more reasonable request than repair. They are meeting their obligations. If you don't want the TV any more, get it repaired and sell it on trademe.

networkn

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#807559 29-Apr-2013 16:52

KiwiNZ:
PaulZA: Thank guys for the replys. Upon reading this, I got my mother to contact their head office to verify if all what they said was correct, and they said it was their company policy if the product died after 7 days, to send it off for repair, instead of replacing it or refund.

We just want our money back, we have lost all faith in the brand, and we're starting to loose faith fast in the warehouse.

You should stand your ground and serve them formal notification of an intention to file a claim under the CGA

WRONG. You are giving this person the incorrect advice, and he would waste his time. It's possible they would cave, but not because he was in the right, but because it isn't worth their time.

I consider the behaviour like this, bullying, and goes against the spirit of the already overbearing burden placed on retailers.

MikeB4

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#807560 29-Apr-2013 16:52

Talkiet:
KiwiNZ: [snip]

I did answer your bold with "The retailer can propose that and the consumer can reject it."

Fair enough... Clearly then every major retailer in the country doesn't understand the act...

http://www.consumer.org.nz/reports/consumer-guarantees-act/putting-it-right

"If the problem is minor, and can be fixed, the retailer can choose to either repair, replace or refund."

A blown capacitor or broken power switch could render a TV unusable, but is a minor, fixable problem (my example).

http://www.ns.org.nz/21.html

"Putting it right
If something goes wrong, you have the right to insist that the seller fixes things.

Generally speaking, this means the retailer who sold you the goods or services must sort out the problem. If the stitching comes apart on your fairly new shoes, you do not have to track down the manufacturer or importer, you simply take them back to the shop. If they tell you the shoes were never much good, it is their problem, not yours.

However, if you have trouble with the seller, you also have the right to get the shoes fixed elsewhere and claim the cost from the seller. But before you do this, you should try to sort things out with the initial seller. If you get nowhere, tell them - preferably in writing - what you are going to do, and keep written records.

If the problem can not be fixed, or can not be put right within a reasonable time, or is substantial, you can:
Reject the product or cancel the service contract and claim a full refund or replacement. Sellers can not offer a credit note only. If you want cash back, you are entitled to it.
Alternatively, consumers may claim compensation for any drop in the value of the product or service, or claim for any reasonably foreseeable extra loss that results from the initial problem. If your new washing machine does not go properly, you can claim for laundry costs or for the cost of hiring a replacement one while the first one is being fixed."

http://www.consumeraffairs.govt.nz/pdf-library/publications/Your-Consumer-Rights--Goods.pdf

"what is the Consumer Guarantees Act?If the problem is minor the trader must provide a remedy of repair. Or thetrader can choose to replace or refund.If the problem is major, you can reject thegoods and choose between a refund orreplacement. Or you can keep the goodsand seek compensation for the reduction in the value of the goods.In most cases which remedy you are entitledto will depend on how serious the problem iswith the goods, and whether you are seekinga remedy from the trader or manufacturer."

http://www.cab.org.nz/vat/consumer/goods/Pages/Gettinggoodsfixed.aspx

"If the good is faulty (i.e. if you didn’t cause the problem) and the problem is minor the retailer can choose between repairing the goods, replacing them or giving you a full refund. If there is a major problem you can return the goods and demand a replacement or a complete refund."

http://www.business.govt.nz/laws-and-regulations/consumer-laws/retailers

"Remedies provided under the Consumer Guarantees Act include repair, refund or replacement of goods and the cancellation of services."

http://www.turnerhopkins.co.nz/news/consumer-guarantees-act-70/

If a defect is discovered in a good or service, and it is relatively small, the retailer can choose to either repair, replace or refund the affected good or service provided the fault is remedied within a reasonable timeframe. If the defect cannot be restored in a timely manner or the defect is substantial, the consumer has the right to reject the product or service.

And I'm out.

Cheers - N

So if said component that rendered the unit a non functioning block was small( given miniaturisation, most likely) then it should be repaired and that decision is at the sellers option only? and if said component is not available in NZ ( most likely with the obscure products the Warehouse sells) it is still "reasonable" for the retailer to insist that that the customer waits weeks if not months until they receive their purchase back? And you will assert that this is the "best practice" New Zealand Retailers and Service providers should adhere to when dealing customer claims and the customer should just live with it.

Talkiet

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#807562 29-Apr-2013 16:54

KiwiNZ: [snip]
So if said component that rendered the unit a non functioning block was small( given miniaturisation, most likely) then it should be repaired and that decision is at the sellers option only? and if said component is not available in NZ ( most likely with the obscure products the Warehouse sells) it is still "reasonable" for the retailer to insist that that the customer waits weeks if not months until they receive their purchase back? And you will assert that this is the "best practice" New Zealand Retailers and Service providers should adhere to when dealing customer claims and the customer should just live with it.

Go read the whole act. One of those 49 instances of "reasonable" covers exactly what you are concerned about.

Cheers - N

Please note all comments are from my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.

networkn

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#807564 29-Apr-2013 16:54

So if said component that rendered the unit a non functioning block was small( given miniaturisation, most likely) then it should be repaired and that decision is at the sellers option only? and if said component is not available in NZ ( most likely with the obscure products the Warehouse sells) it is still "reasonable" for the retailer to insist that that the customer waits weeks if not months until they receive their purchase back? And you will assert that this is the "best practice" New Zealand Retailers and Service providers should adhere to when dealing customer claims and the customer should just live with it.

It's hard to believe you aren't trolling at this point. The act, if you read it, states repairs must be in a reasonable timeframe, obviously months wouldn't be considered reasonable.

gregmcc

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#807569 29-Apr-2013 17:03

Looks like the best thing to do is wait for the repair to be completed, while you are waiting for the repair to be completed, tell the warehouse that you want to see the repair report (what the problem was), use your own judgment to works out if it is a minor or major repair, if it's a major repair you can reject the goods and get a refund, if it's minor then you will have to live with the repair.

BTW have you got something from the warehouse stating how long it will take to fix? anything over 3 weeks would be unreasonable and you can ask for a refund.

There are a few ways to get what you want, you just have to play the game, but be prepared to settle for a repaired tv at worst case.

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MikeB4

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#807576 29-Apr-2013 17:28

It may seem that I am being hard ball on this, however over the years I have assisted many people with disputes like this and it is very hard in New Zealand to get a fair hearing and dealings with retailers and providers. It took a lot of hard work over many years to get the good consumer rights we enjoy in New Zealand and all New Zealanders need to know them and use them and do not allow retailers and providers to erode those rights.

If retailers etc. are not happy with the consumer law, get a new business.

xarqi

727 posts

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#807580 29-Apr-2013 17:33

Talkiet:
http://www.consumer.org.nz/reports/consumer-guarantees-act/putting-it-right

"If the problem is minor, and can be fixed, the retailer can choose to either repair, replace or refund."

http://www.ns.org.nz/21.html

"Putting it right
If something goes wrong, you have the right to insist that the seller fixes things.
[...]
If the problem can not be fixed, or can not be put right within a reasonable time, or is substantial, you can:
Reject the product or cancel the service contract and claim a full refund or replacement. Sellers can not offer a credit note only. If you want cash back, you are entitled to it.

"If the problem is minor, and can be fixed, the retailer can choose to either repair, replace or refund."

Note that it is the PROBLEM that must be minor for this to apply, not the solution. A TV that does not work at all is not a minor problem, it is a substantial one, so ...

"If the problem can not be fixed, or can not be put right within a reasonable time, or is substantial, you can:
- Reject the product or cancel the service contract and claim a full refund or replacement. Sellers can not offer a credit note only. If you want cash back, you are entitled to it."

Seems clear-cut to me.

Talkiet

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#807581 29-Apr-2013 17:35

xarqi: [snip]

"If the problem is minor, and can be fixed, the retailer can choose to either repair, replace or refund."

Note that it is the PROBLEM that must be minor for this to apply, not the solution. A TV that does not work at all is not a minor problem, it is a substantial one, so ...

"If the problem can not be fixed, or can not be put right within a reasonable time, or is substantial, you can:
- Reject the product or cancel the service contract and claim a full refund or replacement. Sellers can not offer a credit note only. If you want cash back, you are entitled to it."

Seems clear-cut to me.

[edit] Stuff it. There's no reasoning with some people.

Cheers - N

Please note all comments are from my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.

xarqi

727 posts

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#807587 29-Apr-2013 17:40

Talkiet:
xarqi: [snip]

"If the problem is minor, and can be fixed, the retailer can choose to either repair, replace or refund."

Note that it is the PROBLEM that must be minor for this to apply, not the solution. A TV that does not work at all is not a minor problem, it is a substantial one, so ...

"If the problem can not be fixed, or can not be put right within a reasonable time, or is substantial, you can:
- Reject the product or cancel the service contract and claim a full refund or replacement. Sellers can not offer a credit note only. If you want cash back, you are entitled to it."

Seems clear-cut to me.

[edit] Stuff it. There's no reasoning with some people.

Cheers - N

Apparently not.

MikeB4

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#807591 29-Apr-2013 17:56

networkn:

So if said component that rendered the unit a non functioning block was small( given miniaturisation, most likely) then it should be repaired and that decision is at the sellers option only? and if said component is not available in NZ ( most likely with the obscure products the Warehouse sells) it is still "reasonable" for the retailer to insist that that the customer waits weeks if not months until they receive their purchase back? And you will assert that this is the "best practice" New Zealand Retailers and Service providers should adhere to when dealing customer claims and the customer should just live with it.

It's hard to believe you aren't trolling at this point. The act, if you read it, states repairs must be in a reasonable timeframe, obviously months wouldn't be considered reasonable.

not trolling and that assertion is somewhat insulting however, the point I am trying to make is, it is not the role of the retailer to "interpret" the law it would be ultra vires to do so. There role is to follow the law.

mattwnz

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#807603 29-Apr-2013 18:28

I don't think this really has anything to do with the CGA, in terms of the refund that teh OP wanted. It is more to do with contract law, and the fact that they do say on their website that that they give a 12 month money back guarantee. So I fail to see why they have only given a 7 day one.

B1GGLZ

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#807614 29-Apr-2013 18:53

PaulZA: Thank guys for the replys. Upon reading this, I got my mother to contact their head office to verify if all what they said was correct, and they said it was their company policy if the product died after 7 days, to send it off for repair, instead of replacing it or refund.

We just want our money back, we have lost all faith in the brand, and we're starting to loose faith fast in the warehouse.

Then if that's their interpretation of their own company policy its about time they rewrote it so it can't be open to interpretation.
Would be interesting to see a legal chllenge in the small claims tribunal.
The whole episode just proves they are still selling rubbish like they always have.

networkn

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#807633 29-Apr-2013 19:27

KiwiNZ: It may seem that I am being hard ball on this, however over the years I have assisted many people with disputes like this and it is very hard in New Zealand to get a fair hearing and dealings with retailers and providers. It took a lot of hard work over many years to get the good consumer rights we enjoy in New Zealand and all New Zealanders need to know them and use them and do not allow retailers and providers to erode those rights.

If retailers etc. are not happy with the consumer law, get a new business.

I would almost guarantee if you have given them the same advice you are trying to give today, you didn't "win" on the merits, but rather the company has decided your bullying tactics are not worth what it will cost to get rid of you. I wouldn't consider that a victory by my set of morals. I believe you as a consumer have a responsibility to be just as fair and reasonable as you expect your retailer to be and not just act in your own short term benefit. The OP has been given a fair and reasonable course of action which falls inside the law and that should be the end of the matter. If they fail in their duty, which I wouldn't expect so in this situation, then there are remedies which are outlined in the same act which the OP should make use of.

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