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No1Daemon

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#16537 14-Oct-2007 21:37
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Hi all

If NZ is going to use MPEG4 for the DVB-T service when it comes in, are there currently any Hybrid/Dual tuners that support MPEG4 or will it simply be a matter of waiting for updated drivers from the manufacturers?

I realise the beauty of the HTPC is you can just pull out and replace your pci card but I am building a system now and would like the technology to still be current next year.

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allstarnz
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  #91035 14-Oct-2007 21:58
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I understand that the encoding is all done by software/mux, so the card should be ok. I can't guarantee that 100%, but I think that's correct.

No1Daemon

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  #91040 14-Oct-2007 22:14
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So updated drivers will do the trick? I am installing a Hauppauge HVR3000 currently and only chose it because it was a hybrid DVB-S/Analogue and also DVB-T and I didn't really want to change cards next year just to use the DVB-T service instead of satellite.


allstarnz
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  #91094 15-Oct-2007 12:20
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yeah, i believe GB-PVR already supports MPEG4.

What you plan to do is exactly the same as me.  I have an HVR3000 too, so will do the same.



sbiddle
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  #91096 15-Oct-2007 12:35
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A HVR3000 or HVR4000 should be fine with appropiate software.

The only unknown at this stage is what impact HDCP could have, Freeview are talking about using HDCP on HD content which IMHO would be a brainless move however it has been talked about so could well happen. If this is the case you would potentially need a motherboard or video card with HDMI and a HDCP certified monitor or TV to view HD content.

There is apparently a DVB-T loop demo being played in Chch at present, hopefully when a few more sites come online people will be able to do some testing.


MuShrOomKing
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  #91108 15-Oct-2007 14:05
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I really hope they don't do Hdcp, it wont be to good for my MCE pc's running at the moment :(

openmedia
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  #91109 15-Oct-2007 14:21
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MuShrOomKing: I really hope they don't do Hdcp, it wont be to good for my MCE pc's running at the moment :(


We need a sticky on this.

HDCP isn't encryption of the broadcast signal.

HDCP is encryption between the STB and the screen.

Hence it won't be an issue if you use a tuner card in your PC.

Steve




Generally known online as OpenMedia, now working for Red Hat APAC as a Technology Evangelist and Portfolio Architect. Still playing with MythTV and digital media on the side.


allstarnz
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  #91113 15-Oct-2007 15:10
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openmedia:
MuShrOomKing: I really hope they don't do Hdcp, it wont be to good for my MCE pc's running at the moment :(


We need a sticky on this.

HDCP isn't encryption of the broadcast signal.

HDCP is encryption between the STB and the screen.

Hence it won't be an issue if you use a tuner card in your PC.

Steve


Thanks for the clarification Steve. 

I hope they don't go down this road.  Another pointless exercise IMO.

As has been proved with almost all copy protection.  There is always a way around it if you are willing to persist.



No1Daemon

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  #91114 15-Oct-2007 15:30
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Thanks for that Openmedia

I checked out the mypvr early on in the piece and it looked quite good.
So what do you mean when you say the hdcp is between the stb and the screen?

sbiddle
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  #91115 15-Oct-2007 15:37
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allstarnz:
I hope they don't go down this road.  Another pointless exercise IMO.

As has been proved with almost all copy protection.  There is always a way around it if you are willing to persist.


There is no simply foolproof way of bypassing HDCP. You can buy HDCP strippers which sit inline but these are not foolproof as the encryption key can easily be revoked leaving you with a doorstop. There are few few operators using HDCP for HD content, primarily because the biggest HD market is the USA and there are millions of people with HD capable TV sets that don't support HDMI or HDCP so TV companies have been careful not to enforce the HDCP flag for fear of annoying a large % of their customer base.

The whole issue of copy protection and DRM is a pile of rubbish but unfortunately it's not going to go away..:-(


sbiddle
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  #91116 15-Oct-2007 15:39
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No1Daemon: Thanks for that Openmedia

So what do you mean when you say the hdcp is between the stb and the screen?


The HDCP flag is passed on from the PC to the output device. Your PVR should be able to record the TV show fine but you will need a PC that can output a signal with HDCP and the only way of doing this is with HDMI output. The PC passes the HDCP signal over the HDMI to your TV but if the TV doesn't support HDCP then the signal can't be viewed.


openmedia
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  #91117 15-Oct-2007 15:39
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No1Daemon: Thanks for that Openmedia

I checked out the mypvr early on in the piece and it looked quite good.
So what do you mean when you say the hdcp is between the stb and the screen?


HDCP is a point to point encryption protocol to prevent snooping of premium content.

When you watch a BluRay or HD-DVD movie they are encrypted on the disk, and decrypted by the player. If the signal from the player to the screen was in the clear it could be snooped. HDCP prevents this by using a different type of encryption on that part of the link.

With STBs much the same thing will occur. For example Sky will use their usual NDS encryption on the broadcast, and the HDCP from the STB to your screen. If you want a HDCP free signal you will need to use SD analogue outputs.

For freeview their is no encryption on broadcast.

Steve




Generally known online as OpenMedia, now working for Red Hat APAC as a Technology Evangelist and Portfolio Architect. Still playing with MythTV and digital media on the side.


No1Daemon

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  #91121 15-Oct-2007 16:14
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Now I see why I joined this site!
Even my head is able to cope with these answers.
Thanks guys

Nety
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  #91137 15-Oct-2007 18:53
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openmedia:

For freeview their is no encryption on broadcast.

Steve


Freeview must be able to force the device receiving the signal to be using HDCP? If that is the case then you will not be able to record it unless the HDCP allows it. If not then what would the point be in using it at all?

I know how HDCP works in a Disk to screen situation but not sure how it works over the air?







Media centre PC - Case Silverstone LC16M with 2 X 80mm AcoustiFan DustPROOF, MOBO Gigabyte MA785GT-UD3H, CPU AMD X2 240 under volted, RAM 4 Gig DDR3 1033, HDD 120Gig System/512Gig data, Tuners 2 X Hauppauge HVR-3000, 1 X HVR-2200, Video Palit GT 220, Sound Realtek 886A HD (onboard), Optical LiteOn DH-401S Blue-ray using TotalMedia Theatre Power Corsair VX Series, 450W ATX PSU OS Windows 7 x64

openmedia
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  #91141 15-Oct-2007 19:17
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Nety:
openmedia:

For freeview their is no encryption on broadcast.

Steve


Freeview must be able to force the device receiving the signal to be using HDCP? If that is the case then you will not be able to record it unless the HDCP allows it. If not then what would the point be in using it at all?

I know how HDCP works in a Disk to screen situation but not sure how it works over the air?


freeview can request the STB to turn HDCP off/on, but the STB could be setup to ignore the signal. Also it is possible to display a HD signal on a TV without HDCP. Our box (myPVR) can output full 720p and 1080p HD without HDCP.

Steve




Generally known online as OpenMedia, now working for Red Hat APAC as a Technology Evangelist and Portfolio Architect. Still playing with MythTV and digital media on the side.


rhysb
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  #91163 15-Oct-2007 21:32
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Some of the newer Nvidia & ATI cards provide HDCP over DVI, so you don't necessarily need to have an HDMI output.







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