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43 posts

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#272759 14-Jul-2020 16:40
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Hi there,

 

just wondering if anyone knows who I can get in touch with on behalf of a client of mine. His business connection (non Vodafone) was disconnected and churned away from his ISP (who had no control as it was pre-approved) to Vodafone without my client's approval or knowledge.

 

We've tried Vodafone directly and they advised we need to get in touch via the account holder (in the neighbouring office on the same floor). So we got the account holder to get in touch and provide a contact. Now I've tried talking to the "Enterprise Set-Up Specialist Service Delivery" but they've basically brushed us off. I'm trying with them again but in case he's not going to respond, just thought I'd check here.

 

Thanks all

 

 

 

 


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Chorus

  #2522869 14-Jul-2020 17:05
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Is this for a copper or fibre service? Your first port of call would be calling your client's actual RSP and asking them to arrange a return of service to them, and expediting it to Chorus (or LFC) due to beng slammed. 

 

The RSP who made the mistake (Vodafone in this case) generally won't do anything to reverse their wrong - it's up to the losing service provider to instigate the transfer back to them.





The views expressed by me are not necessarily those of my employer Chorus NZ Ltd




43 posts

Geek


  #2522874 14-Jul-2020 17:18
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Thanks for that. My client’s ISP rolled out a whole new connection on a spare port on the ONT. One that they checked was inactive first. so that was dealt with relatively quickly.

I’m just wondering if there is anyone we can talk to at VF for at least an explanation if not compensation for IT support he received due to the error made.

 
 
 
 


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  #2523087 14-Jul-2020 19:41
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theflinch: Thanks for that. My client’s ISP rolled out a whole new connection on a spare port on the ONT. One that they checked was inactive first. so that was dealt with relatively quickly.

I’m just wondering if there is anyone we can talk to at VF for at least an explanation if not compensation for IT support he received due to the error made.

 

Unless your client plans to go down the legal route as a matter of principle there is no way you'll get any kind of compensation out of VF

 

It sucks, but you'll probably also want to really push home that it was an incorrect churn as it wouldn't surprise me if it happened again as they attempt to "move the connection" after some possibly heated discussions with the intended customer wondering when they will get service. Maybe get someone higher up who will actually listen involved to try and stop this now @JasonParis




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Geek


  #2523091 14-Jul-2020 20:19
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Thanks @snnet

 

It does indeed suck and we're prepared to get completely ignored/brushed off which is not to say it wouldn't be completely frustrating and disappointing.

 

We'll see what happens. I have requested to get in touch with someone higher up, but am not optimistic about our chances.

 

 


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  #2523129 14-Jul-2020 21:57
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Dunno if @jasonparis is still active around here, but if he is you can't get much higher up the totem pole.





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  #2523241 15-Jul-2020 08:31
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It's really not possible to churn or slam an active connection without customer details or the gaining RSP going through an abandonment process. There is almost certainly a lot more details to this.

 

I am however not sure what the OP is wanting from Vodafone, if they want the primary connection back it's up to the LSP to action that.

 

 

 

 


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  #2523259 15-Jul-2020 09:24
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theflinch:

 

...on behalf of a client of mine.

 

...the account holder (in the neighbouring office on the same floor). So we got the account holder to get in touch and provide a contact...

 

 

So, the a/c holder isnt the 'client of mine' you 1st mentioned ?


 
 
 
 




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Geek


  #2523503 15-Jul-2020 13:47
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@1101, the account holder is my client's new office neighbour. 

 

@sbiddle, that's why we're not sure how this happened. We're not sure how the line got churned over as they wouldn't have had my client's account details. It's not about the primary line anymore as my client's ISP got them back up and running pretty quickly by setting up another line. It's about the time and money wasted on initial troubleshooting and work lost while the internet was down for just over a day. We think it could have completely avoided. Couple main points I think are key:

 

  • VF obviously didn't really check account holder details.
  • They didn't question why there was already an active connection on the port they used on the ONT 

I spoke at length with my client's ISP on how this could have happened and we speculate Vodafone just skipped over their checks. The account holder is also partly to blame as he unplugged my client's equipment, but my client and I are talking to him directly and he's tried to put us in touch with VF directly, but as I mentioned VF aren't even acknowledging the mistake at this stage which is not unexpected.

 

Happy to provide more details, but just wanted to see if I could get the attention of someone from VF here. 

 

Also, has anyone working in the industry had a client's internet or their own business internet connection churned away through no fault or action of their own? 1st time it's happened to us.


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  #2523525 15-Jul-2020 14:31
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@theflinch I'm happy to have a poke around to see what happened here - and I've got contacts in the Set Up space that would be interested in anything we can learn from this situation.

 

Just to make sure I've understood correctly: your client had (and now has again) a fibre connection with another RSP; and their new office neighbour asked us to set up a fibre connection at the same address. The neighbour's connection should have gone onto the second ONT port but was incorrectly provisioned on the first port (thus disconnecting your client). Is that correct?





I work in the Corporate/Government space for Vodafone NZ, but I know at least a little bit about a lot of things we do. I volunteer my time on here, and all opinions expressed are my own and do not necessarily reflect those of my employer.


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  #2523533 15-Jul-2020 14:51
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Was this Chorus or a LFC?

 

The only conclusion I can reach is what is posted in the post above - another RSP lodged a secondary connection that was somehow promoted to the primary.

 

 




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Geek


  #2523535 15-Jul-2020 14:52
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Hi @konfusd. Thanks.

 

That's correct, client is with another RSP who provisioned a new line on port 2 to get them working again in the quickest time possible.

 

New office neighbour is at same address and requested a new connection.

 

Also correct regarding ONT port mix-up

 

Other notes:

 

I've not heard back from the Enterprise Set-Up Specialist yet that the neighbour provided the contact for. I've also lodged a complaint via the VF online complaints form.

 

 

 

 

 

 




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Geek


  #2523565 15-Jul-2020 15:41
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sbiddle:

 

Was this Chorus or a LFC?

 

The only conclusion I can reach is what is posted in the post above - another RSP lodged a secondary connection that was somehow promoted to the primary.

 

 

 

 

It's Chorus.

 

Yep. pretty much what happened. Got provisioned, incorrectly, on port 1. Anything like this happen to you before, Steve?


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  #2523568 15-Jul-2020 15:48
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theflinch:

 

sbiddle:

 

Was this Chorus or a LFC?

 

The only conclusion I can reach is what is posted in the post above - another RSP lodged a secondary connection that was somehow promoted to the primary.

 

 

 

 

It's Chorus.

 

Yep. pretty much what happened. Got provisioned, incorrectly, on port 1. Anything like this happen to you before, Steve?

 

 

Nope. And it's all automated so I don't know how this could happen.

 

 




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  #2523675 15-Jul-2020 18:26
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hmmm didn't realise it was automated. very strange.


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  #2523846 15-Jul-2020 22:47
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Multiple tenants sharing a singular address point (such as two divided but not separately titled office spaces on the same floor of a commercial building) do tend to cause problems from time to time. It's hard to say exactly what happened in this case unless we know the order type used:

 

If a Connect & Replace was used, a notification would have been sent to your client's RSP giving them 5 days to check with your client whether he had vacated the property or not. If your client advises their RSP that he has not vacated, your client's RSP simply rejects the C&R request and no further action is required - the other RSP is notified that the C&R has been rejected which should prompt them to question their customer about the address. However if your client's RSP got the notification and took no action, then after 5 days your client would have been automatically disconnected and the Vodafone line would have been activated for the neighbour on your client's ONT. For the record, this is the correct process RSP's should follow in this instance, as it allows time for any incorrect connection request to be stopped. If the latter is what happened in your client's case then it is not a genuine slamming scenario - your client's RSP had the opportunity to stop it but didn't.

 

However an incoming RSP/customer also has the ability to use the Transfer process (although in this scenario this is the wrong process). On a Transfer request, the other RSP (Vodafone in this case) merely has to guess who your client's RSP is in order for the Transfer request to be accepted. There is no other validation required for a fibre transfer. Once the order is submitted with the correct losing service provider details, the order proceeds without delay and the first your client's RSP will know about it is when they receive a Cease Billing notification from Chorus - and their customer loses service. The Transfer process should only be used when an existing customer at a site is changing from one RSP to another, however some RSP's habitually use this process to connect a new customer at a site to the detriment of the existing customer (they get slammed in the truest sense of the word).

 

As a Service Delivery Manager at Chorus, I deal with Transfers and Connect & Replace scenarios gone wrong on an almost daily basis. As I specifically look after Spark I am not in a position to provide much in-depth information in this case, however at the very least if the OP flicks me the address of the connection and his client's name in a DM, I can confirm which of the two above processes was used in this case.

 

Unfortunately if there are two tenantable spaces on a floor, and a single ONT in a mutually accessible area, it's always possible for this to happen. Likewise even if there are two ONTs, unless there is effective questioning and/or investigation, it's always possible for an RSP to select the wrong ONT causing the wrongful disconnection of one party. For example if an RSP wishes to connect a customer at an address point with two ONTs showing, and one of those ONTs shows as not in use in Chorus Portal, you'd expect that RSP to pick the unused ONT, but some RSPs do frequently choose the working ONT to run their order on with no questioning, for reasons I will never fully understand. 

 

 





The views expressed by me are not necessarily those of my employer Chorus NZ Ltd


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