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networkn

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#93230 16-Nov-2011 19:03
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Hi There!

I have been going to the same panel beater for 5 years. I have been pretty unlucky with my cars lately (not my fault except for the last time) and this guy has seen me around 6 times in that time. I would estimate 10-12K from my insurance company.

He provides loan cars, a must for me, and each time we have had to sign a bit of paper to say we accept liability etc, and that we would need to pay an insurance fee of $15 + GST per day of loan. My wife and I have both had our cars in and never been invoiced for this amount.

My last repair was major and it took him 41 days to repair the car which included an extra week and a bit for parts since he didn't assess it properly for damage and needed more 2/3 of the way through.

Today I have gone to pickup the car and been given a bill for $700.

He is saying he won't back down and I need to pay it.

My arguments against it:

1) We have never been charged before, creating an expectation we were exempt for some reason
2) We were not told that this time would be different from any other, therefore leaving us unaware we would be charged.
3) Had we of known I would have chosen to supply another car myself (a much better one at that) or taken the car to another location that doesn't charge these fees. I called 3 at random today who don't charge. 
4) $700 seems ridiculous to me for 41 days of insurance cover, I know that my car, which is likely in excess of 10x as valuable and is insured for commercial use, is only $500 more per YEAR.
5) He originally estimated a fortnight for the repair.


His argument

1) I signed to say I'd pay it.

The complication is that I left my sons stroller in the boot of the car, and he is saying he will not allow me to collect it until I pay the outstanding money. 

 
What should I do? 

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kiwitrc
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  #546158 16-Nov-2011 19:13
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$15 a day is a bloody cheap rental car, I guess you need consider the cost of not having it for 41 days, could you get to and fro on public transport for $15 a day? Also probably worth adding in the times you havent had to pay and the average cost comes down a hell of a lot.

I can see where you are coming from, especially the expectation that in the past you havent had to pay, maybe since he cocked up the parts delivery you could negotiate the extra week off?

Edit: Actually if he estimated 2 weeks to fix it then really he should meet you half way IMO



networkn

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  #546160 16-Nov-2011 19:21
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Well I guess my issue is, that if he had of told me $15 a day I would have gone elsewhere, where I could still have had my car fixed, got a loaner and not had to pay anything.


kiwitrc
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  #546161 16-Nov-2011 19:25
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Ah, ok didn't realise he didn't tell you that. Might need to edit your post to clarify.



networkn

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  #546164 16-Nov-2011 19:28
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Well what I am saying is that the previous 5 times we were not charged, no mention of it, no charge, this time, no specific mention (Same form as last 5 times filled out) and this time we were charged. If he intended to charge us this time, it would be reasonable that he had created an expectation of not being charged, he specifically mention he was no longer going to waive the fee's. This would have allowed us to choose if we paid.


networkn

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  #546165 16-Nov-2011 19:30
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Also $15 a day might be a cheap rental, however, $700 for 5 weeks isn't that cheap.

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  #546172 16-Nov-2011 19:41
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I know it's not that helpful in this case but what does your insurance policy say in regards to rental cars? Most companies offer very cheap rentals if your car is being repaired.


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  #546173 16-Nov-2011 19:43
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Pay to get your car back, and give back rental (if you havent already). Advise you will dispute this with the dispute tribunal.

Otherwise your open to further charges.

 
 
 

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networkn

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  #546184 16-Nov-2011 20:12
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sbiddle, insurance won't cover it, I tried that angle already.

The only thing he has right now is my sons stroller (Which was still very expensive).

I am hoping he will not reasonably hold that to ransom.

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  #546187 16-Nov-2011 20:22
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networkn: sbiddle, insurance won't cover it, I tried that angle already.

The only thing he has right now is my sons stroller (Which was still very expensive).

I am hoping he will not reasonably hold that to ransom.


Insurance won't cover it, but virtually every insurance policy I'd looked at (including the one I have) offer cheap rental cars while your car is being repaired. Last time I asked when my car was being repaired it was around $50 per week from memory.


gzt

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  #546198 16-Nov-2011 20:47
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networkn: He provides loan cars, a must for me, and each time we have had to sign a bit of paper to say we accept liability etc, and that we would need to pay an insurance fee of $15 + GST per day of loan.

Slightly off topic, but your own insurance would cover you for driving someone else's car would it not? If that is the case, his charge for insurance seems redundant.

Probably neither party wants to spend time at the disputes tribunal, explain how you feel, ask why he didn't charge it previously, and suggest a reasonable settlement figure to him on that basis.

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  #546203 16-Nov-2011 21:03
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I can empathise with your situation but I think I am with the panel beater on this one. You agreed to a cost per day for the loan-car (what that cost was actually for is a redundant argument). You were lucky in the past that you did not end up having to pay for that facility. This time he decided to enforce the agreement to the letter. I don't think you have a leg to stand on.

Your only option is to try an negotiate (be reasonable!) or just pay up to get your property and then consider small claims tribunal to recover some/all your money if you're lucky.

Good luck





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networkn

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  #546299 17-Nov-2011 09:18
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Actually what that cost was for ISN'T a redundant situation, I was told the loan car was FREE and this was an insurance surcharge. If he he charging for insurance, and putting a margin on top, he is actually BROKERING insurance which is highly illegal under NZ law without a license. If it's NOT for insurance only, he is actually in breach of the fair trading act for misleading me as to what I was paying for. I'd rather not go down this legal route, but for $700 I am quite prepared to.

John2010
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  #546331 17-Nov-2011 09:58
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networkn: Actually what that cost was for ISN'T a redundant situation, I was told the loan car was FREE and this was an insurance surcharge. If he he charging for insurance, and putting a margin on top, he is actually BROKERING insurance which is highly illegal under NZ law without a license.


That would seem to me from what you have said to only be the case if the insurance was then taken out in your name. I assume that it was not - perhaps you could clarify??

Otherwise, like the rest of us we are entitled to consider the costs of insurance as legitimate costs when we determine charge out rates or sticker prices for our services and products.

networkn

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  #546337 17-Nov-2011 10:04
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Yes and if his products were more expensive because he had built in those costs, then that would be valid, but to suggest that the loan cars are free and then charge an insurance surcharge indicates a different thing altogether.

I have raised the issue with him via email and suggested I was happy to make a small contribution to which he sent me his invoice with 50% removed. I'm consider what I do at this point, but I still feel 50% is misleading.

Likely I'll just pay it.

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  #546345 17-Nov-2011 10:15
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All a bit confusing but looks like you are upset at the amount charged but were fully aware of it as you have seen it on the form you signed.

The fact he hasn't charged you before has not much to do with it given he has a signature on document, nor is it relevant whether it is legal or not as these are seperate issues.

I agree with one poster that if it ran over time that isn't your fault so should not have to pay for any days over that and would think you have a good case to argue.

Generally there are 2 sides to every story and to be fair we haven't heard his so hard to make a call either way until that is known.





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