Noisy trains.

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#604465 3-Apr-2012 12:33

mckenndk:
old3eyes: I can never understand on the J'ville line why they didn't do what they did to the old Melbourne port line and convert it from heavy rail to tram operation. It would have been an ideal candidate as it has no other heavy rain traffic on it but i guess that's too simple for the politicians who run Wellington..

It would mean a complete rebuild of the system and having to support different rolling stock, infrastructer, power voltage, etc.
Why completly rebuild something when you already have stations, rolling stock, staff trained in the current ways of doing things, signals etc.

You will probably have to find someone other than Tranz Metro to run it which will cause problems and Tranz Metro will not give up its staff trained in its equiptment to a new company as they struggle to get enough staff as it is.

Then you will also piss off the passangers who will have to travel every day by bus in busy traffic until the rebuild is complete.

There was talk years ago about turning it into a guided bus way what I am glad they did not as the ones I have used over seas were not a comfortable ride and I see the Edinburgh one has now been abandond and part of it being turned into a tramway.

Dion

Wasn't it closed for moths while they did the tunnels etc for this rebuild??

Regards,

Old3eyes

Klipspringer

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#604494 3-Apr-2012 13:02

Very interesting comment here on Stuff.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/news/northern-suburbs/6680711/Matangi-train-noise-upsets-residents

Drew B: I'm not one to comment here, but I am going too because I'm sick of the cock up of the new trains. Teh delays which promised us for them to be in use over a year late and other cock ups.

The one that's relevant to this is that the first set of trains were on the wrong current type. They came in on AC when our lines are DC. Which meant convertors were installed (the high pitched noise they talk about) to convert the current back to the correct type.

Why is no one getting questioned over this ?

------------------

I seem to recall major problems with the first lot of Matangi's that arrived. Power problems.

So is it possible that the original lot, have been deployed onto the Johnsonville line with noisy AC/DC Converters?

I have ridden the Matangi. And even witnessed them going passed and overall I think its quieter. Maybe the Johnsonville lot are different?

vinnieg

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#604504 3-Apr-2012 13:16

freitasm:
Done that. Town to airport in 1/4 of the time the bus takes. Half of the time the train speeds up to 430 Km/h. The other half of the time the train is slowing down to stop at the airport. After 300 Km/h it's all just a blur outside the windows. People stand up to take photos under the displays throughout the train showing the speed...

I think I'll have to put Shanghai, with a cross over to Japan on my agenda, mostly for that ride!

I'd love to experience it!

I remember pulling out the camera to take a photo of Mt Fuji, and by the time the camera was on, we had passed it :(

Braaiguy:

So is it possible that the original lot, have been deployed onto the Johnsonville line with noisy AC/DC Converters?

I think that Drew is wrong about the AC/DC converters. They were factory built into the trains, and there is no real problem with them. The initial problems they had were with the substations/points failure. So they upgraded them.

I see a lot of comments on the stuff article about the new horn. And I have to agree, it sounds like american trucking horn. It's loud, and piercing. I cringe every time I hear one near my house(I'm about 150-200m from the track)

I actually work just across from the station, so might be able to get a video of a train going past tomorrow if anyone wants it. Just to show the noise difference, and possibly the annoying new horn!

I have moved across the ditch. Now residing in Melbourne as a VOIP/Video Technical Trainer/Engineer.

gehenna

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#604538 3-Apr-2012 13:37

I do hear the trains squeaking along the tracks going past, never used to in the past. In fact we were driving alongside the train last night on our way from Ngaio and Khandallah and I could hear the tracks squeaking over the music we had playing inside the car. I can certainly understand why residents are unhappy, especially considering these trains run late into the evening right through a residential area.

vinnieg

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#604550 3-Apr-2012 13:44

gehenna: I do hear the trains squeaking along the tracks going past, never used to in the past. In fact we were driving alongside the train last night on our way from Ngaio and Khandallah and I could hear the tracks squeaking over the music we had playing inside the car. I can certainly understand why residents are unhappy, especially considering these trains run late into the evening right through a residential area.

Hmmm, that sounds more like it's a track/axle tracking problem, or a friction issue?

I guess if they get many complaints about the squeaking, they'll have to investigate

The Jville line has a lot more curves/inclines than the Kapiti, or Hutt lines, so I guess that might explain why those residents are hearing it more too

I have moved across the ditch. Now residing in Melbourne as a VOIP/Video Technical Trainer/Engineer.

mattwnz

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#604554 3-Apr-2012 13:49

old3eyes:
mckenndk:
old3eyes: I can never understand on the J'ville line why they didn't do what they did to the old Melbourne port line and convert it from heavy rail to tram operation. It would have been an ideal candidate as it has no other heavy rain traffic on it but i guess that's too simple for the politicians who run Wellington..

It would?mean a complete rebuild of the system and having to support different rolling stock, infrastructer, power voltage,?etc.
Why completly rebuild something when you already have stations, rolling stock,?staff trained in the current ways of doing things, signals etc.

You will probably have to find someone other than Tranz Metro to run it which will cause?problems and?Tranz?Metro will not give up its staff trained in its equiptment to a new company as they struggle to get enough staff as it is.

Then you will also piss off the passangers who will have to travel every day by bus in busy traffic until the rebuild is complete.??

There was talk years ago about turning it into a guided?bus way what I am glad they did not as?the ones I have used over seas were not a comfortable ride and I see the?Edinburgh one has now been abandond and part of it being turned into a tramway.

Dion ?

Wasn't it closed for moths while they did the tunnels etc for this rebuild??

Yes, I beleive that was to accommodate the larger trains in the tunnels. the old ones dating back to the 30's used to be a lot smaller, which is why the 80's ones couldn't be used on that line. It wouldn't have made sense to have another infrastructure (eg trams) , I don't think that would have been economically sustainable. I do believe they were initially looking at making it a bus lane with a bus tunnel, but that never got traction, and I think they also would have had to increase teh tunnel size for that. I think they have done the right thing, as they can use those trains now on any line.

mattwnz

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#604560 3-Apr-2012 13:58

vinnieg:
gehenna: I do hear the trains squeaking along the tracks going past, never used to in the past. In fact we were driving alongside the train last night on our way from Ngaio and Khandallah and I could hear the tracks squeaking over the music we had playing inside the car. I can certainly understand why residents are unhappy, especially considering these trains run late into the evening right through a residential area.

Hmmm, that sounds more like it's a track/axle tracking problem, or a friction issue?

I guess if they get many complaints about the squeaking, they'll have to investigate

The Jville line has a lot more curves/inclines than the Kapiti, or Hutt lines, so I guess that might explain why those residents are hearing it more too

?

They should try living next to the hutt line, then they will know how loud it can get with the freight trains going by at 3am. I think these residents could also be more worried about their house prices, as noise from trains they may think could affect their property values. Unfortunately you can't please everyone, and there are a lot of NIMBY's out there.

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vinnieg

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#604561 3-Apr-2012 14:01

mattwnz:

They should try living next to the hutt line, then they will know how loud it can get with the freight trains going by at 3am. I think these residents could also be more worried about their house prices, as noise from trains they may think could affect their property values. Unfortunately you can't please everyone, and there are a lot of NIMBY's out there.

Yeah definitely, I'm just west of the Kapiti line, so we get a few freight trains through, mostly the main trunk ones. I think you guys are getting more and more logging trains from the Wairarapa through...partially due to my work(sorry). As we've got 10 log carriages now, to try relieve some of the congestion from the roads

I see the train stations close proximity as a value point in my property, but I can see how some people might see it differently

I have moved across the ditch. Now residing in Melbourne as a VOIP/Video Technical Trainer/Engineer.

mattwnz

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#604567 3-Apr-2012 14:15

vinnieg:
mattwnz:

They should try living next to the hutt line, then they will know how loud it can get with the freight trains going by at 3am. I think these residents could also be more worried about their house prices, as noise from trains they may think could affect their property values. Unfortunately you can't please everyone, and there are a lot of NIMBY's out there.

Yeah definitely, I'm just west of the Kapiti line, so we get a few freight trains through, mostly the main trunk ones. ?I think you guys are getting more and more logging trains from the Wairarapa through...partially due to my work(sorry). ?As we've got 10 log carriages now, to try relieve some of the congestion from the roads

I see the train stations close proximity as a value point in my property, but I can see how some people might see it differently

People who live next to trains do get used to it. I think it is good that we are using trains more, especially for logging and other freight, as it reduces wear and traffic on the roads, and we do have a pretty good train infrastructure, albeit a bit run down. I would hate to think how much it would cost to build the rimutuka tunnel (even the Wellington tunnels) in todays money especially with the RMA and all the other red tape. I would doubt NZ could afford it these days, so it is good that it is being used.

geekiegeek

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#604573 3-Apr-2012 14:20

freitasm:
vinnieg: As far as I've heard, there is only 1 Maglev operating in Japan, and the other operating in Shanghai

Done that. Town to airport in 1/4 of the time the bus takes. Half of the time the train speeds up to 430 Km/h. The other half of the time the train is slowing down to stop at the airport. After 300 Km/h it's all just a blur outside the windows. People stand up to take photos under the displays throughout the train showing the speed...

I have just such a photo :-)

vinnieg

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#604581 3-Apr-2012 14:26

geekiegeek:

I have just such a photo :-)

Don't leave us hanging!

Haha, you gotta post it!

Here's my pic of the Hikari, Tokyo Station December 2011, great trip! Waiting for the train to stop, and the cleaners to get on

I have moved across the ditch. Now residing in Melbourne as a VOIP/Video Technical Trainer/Engineer.

mckenndk

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#604586 3-Apr-2012 14:37

Wasn't it closed for moths while they did the tunnels etc for this rebuild??

Yes it was during the off peak period over christmas and weekends but the hutt and Tawa lines were no different during the major upgrade.

If you wanted to close it down for converting to bus or light rail it will all be closed for months as you cannot just run train in the middle of the conversion while you could with the current upgrade as there were no changes to platform heights, overhead voltages, signaling etc which you would get it you were converting to a light rail system or guided bus way.

People do get use to trains pretty quickly, I stayed for a few weeks in Paekakariki in a place that was less than 20meters from the main trunk and I got use to it after a few days after getting woken up by every passing train the first two nights.

I just believe that now they have got the new trains they need something else to complain about.

I did see that they dedicated a few sets to the Jvill for flang lubrication testing as they have put labels on the front them.

Dion

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#604587 3-Apr-2012 14:38

geekiegeek:
freitasm:
vinnieg: As far as I've heard, there is only 1 Maglev operating in Japan, and the other operating in Shanghai

Done that. Town to airport in 1/4 of the time the bus takes. Half of the time the train speeds up to 430 Km/h. The other half of the time the train is slowing down to stop at the airport. After 300 Km/h it's all just a blur outside the windows. People stand up to take photos under the displays throughout the train showing the speed...

I have just such a photo :-)

Me too...

nickb800

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#604591 3-Apr-2012 14:40

mattwnz:

They should try living next to the hutt line, then they will know how loud it can get with the freight trains going by at 3am. I think these residents could also be more worried about their house prices, as noise from trains they may think could affect their property values. Unfortunately you can't please everyone, and there are a lot of NIMBY's out there.

And lets not forget that the preexisiting rail noise is already internalised into the price of their properties i.e. they got a cheaper house for it.

The issue of slightly increased noise from Matangis probably wont be internalised in the housing market, however, i suspect its a marginal increase in noise (decrease in value) compared to what you already get from a railway line, so will have a negligible effect

stevenz

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#604609 3-Apr-2012 15:16

old3eyes: Wasn't it closed for moths while they did the tunnels etc for this rebuild??

Yep, they were getting in through the windows and eating the upholstery.

/sorry.

@KnightNZ

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