Police above the law ?

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656 posts

Ultimate Geek
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#1219891 22-Jan-2015 11:13

KiwiNZ:
heylinb4nz:
KiwiNZ:
DravidDavid:
KiwiNZ: I was reading your post right to the point when you pulled out the most inane line used by the pro gun lobby that is "Guns don't kill people, People kill people"

It was a pro gun statement as I am pro gun. It's not inane, it's logic.

Mainly because by any other logic, kitchen knives would be running around by themselves hacking and slashing people in shopping malls, while toolboxes around the globe built cars all by themselves.

A gun is a tool used by people. It's down to the person what they choose to do with it. If that's killing, then that's down to the person behind the trigger. The government does not have some magical law cure for for a trigger finger or gun ownership. I've seen plenty of evidence of that in the last few months just within a 10KM radius from my house in West Auckland.

I don't blame you for not understanding. It's a generational thing to rely on the government for comfort, protection and support. I see the other side of the coin. The side that sees through the lies and stupidity and knows that they can't be trusted.

With that, I think I'm done with this thread.

It is inane, and the arguments postulated by the pro gun lobby only serve to reinforce that firearms should not be in the hands of the general public.

I think history has provided examples where governments shouldn't be allowed them either, but given the choice and the fact that it is people that should hold the balance of power not government I think id rather see the public with them with appropriate measures to ensure safety and the right people get them.

Fact is NZ Police dont want the public to have them and are slowing legislating them out with law changes under the radar and by using devious means.

As much as you cant fathom the public having firearms, I cant fathom why you would support taking them all away and giving unlimited power and trust to the government, its mental.

WOW, You do know where we live, its not 1775 and revolution is not on the horizon.

Again the Police DO NOT legislate.

You don't need to go back as far as 1775, and what makes you think that people in power today are any different ? the methods may have changed but they are still fallible to taking advantage of their population.

RE: Police legislating, they may not write \ sign off the legislation themselves but they are the ones that come up with the basis and for it to serve their agenda, and how quickly you forget the MSSA thumbhole stock saga, or the hand in policy, police policy sold to the public as law, even used our own money to advertise it. The judge in the case even quoted Police are there to enforce law not to make it.

raytaylor

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#1219902 22-Jan-2015 11:23

heylinb4nz: http://www.stuff.co.nz/waikato-times/news/64937416/Whakatane-cop-not-charged-over-dog-shooting

I wonder what would happen in the exact same case with a civilian ? or if the bow and arrow was swapped with say an Air Rifle ?.

I think that when the police decide not to charge someone, a civilian should be able to hire a lawyer and continue to try and prosecute the offender in court, based on the evidence they can muster.

Ray Taylor

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ubergeeknz

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Vocus

#1219905 22-Jan-2015 11:25

raytaylor:
heylinb4nz: http://www.stuff.co.nz/waikato-times/news/64937416/Whakatane-cop-not-charged-over-dog-shooting

I wonder what would happen in the exact same case with a civilian ? or if the bow and arrow was swapped with say an Air Rifle ?.

I think that when the police decide not to charge someone, a civilian should be able to hire a lawyer and continue to try and prosecute the offender in court, based on the evidence they can muster.

Isn't this what happened with John Banks?

MikeB4

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#1219909 22-Jan-2015 11:27

raytaylor:
heylinb4nz: http://www.stuff.co.nz/waikato-times/news/64937416/Whakatane-cop-not-charged-over-dog-shooting

I wonder what would happen in the exact same case with a civilian ? or if the bow and arrow was swapped with say an Air Rifle ?.

I think that when the police decide not to charge someone, a civilian should be able to hire a lawyer and continue to try and prosecute the offender in court, based on the evidence they can muster.

That can happen, example the Waitara Police shooting which after many court hearings the Police Officer involved was exonerated

MikeB4

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#1219915 22-Jan-2015 11:30

heylinb4nz:

You don't need to go back as far as 1775, and what makes you think that people in power today are any different ? the methods may have changed but they are still fallible to taking advantage of their population.

RE: Police legislating, they may not write \ sign off the legislation themselves but they are the ones that come up with the basis and for it to serve their agenda, and how quickly you forget the MSSA thumbhole stock saga, or the hand in policy, police policy sold to the public as law, even used our own money to advertise it. The judge in the case even quoted Police are there to enforce law not to make it.

honestly, you are just writing fantasy, unless I am missing the action of our totalitarian regime we have here.

As for military style rifles? the only place for them is in the hands of the military.

heylinb4nz

656 posts

Ultimate Geek
Inactive user

#1219916 22-Jan-2015 11:30

raytaylor:
heylinb4nz: http://www.stuff.co.nz/waikato-times/news/64937416/Whakatane-cop-not-charged-over-dog-shooting

I wonder what would happen in the exact same case with a civilian ? or if the bow and arrow was swapped with say an Air Rifle ?.

I think that when the police decide not to charge someone, a civilian should be able to hire a lawyer and continue to try and prosecute the offender in court, based on the evidence they can muster.

Pointless when you consider

a) they have limitless legal funding courtesy of your tax dollar
b) our judges are biased (or just muppets)
c) if the offender is a police officer, be prepared to have the case deliberately drawn out

MikeB4

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#1219917 22-Jan-2015 11:32

heylinb4nz:
raytaylor:
heylinb4nz: http://www.stuff.co.nz/waikato-times/news/64937416/Whakatane-cop-not-charged-over-dog-shooting

I wonder what would happen in the exact same case with a civilian ? or if the bow and arrow was swapped with say an Air Rifle ?.

I think that when the police decide not to charge someone, a civilian should be able to hire a lawyer and continue to try and prosecute the offender in court, based on the evidence they can muster.

Pointless when you consider

a) they have limitless legal funding courtesy of your tax dollar
b) our judges are biased (or just muppets)
c) if the offender is a police officer, be prepared to have the case deliberately drawn out

Are you suggesting we do away with the following...
1. Government
2. The Police
3. The Courts

My mind boggles at your posts

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heylinb4nz

656 posts

Ultimate Geek
Inactive user

#1219922 22-Jan-2015 11:36

KiwiNZ:
heylinb4nz:

You don't need to go back as far as 1775, and what makes you think that people in power today are any different ? the methods may have changed but they are still fallible to taking advantage of their population.

RE: Police legislating, they may not write \ sign off the legislation themselves but they are the ones that come up with the basis and for it to serve their agenda, and how quickly you forget the MSSA thumbhole stock saga, or the hand in policy, police policy sold to the public as law, even used our own money to advertise it. The judge in the case even quoted Police are there to enforce law not to make it.

honestly, you are just writing fantasy, unless I am missing the action of our totalitarian regime we have here.

As for military style rifles? the only place for them is in the hands of the military.

Oh hear we go. "My son was in the army so I know all about firearms" . Dont even get me started on NZ Police definition of MSSA and the misguided legislation they have forced onto us trying to control these so called "Evil Guns".

heylinb4nz

656 posts

Ultimate Geek
Inactive user

#1219926 22-Jan-2015 11:40

KiwiNZ:
heylinb4nz:
raytaylor:
heylinb4nz: http://www.stuff.co.nz/waikato-times/news/64937416/Whakatane-cop-not-charged-over-dog-shooting

I wonder what would happen in the exact same case with a civilian ? or if the bow and arrow was swapped with say an Air Rifle ?.

I think that when the police decide not to charge someone, a civilian should be able to hire a lawyer and continue to try and prosecute the offender in court, based on the evidence they can muster.

Pointless when you consider

a) they have limitless legal funding courtesy of your tax dollar
b) our judges are biased (or just muppets)
c) if the offender is a police officer, be prepared to have the case deliberately drawn out

Are you suggesting we do away with the following...
1. Government
2. The Police
3. The Courts

My mind boggles at your posts

No i'm suggesting that we need a complete re-look at our justice system, police policies, much of our criminal and firearms legislation. Im talking an overhaul and removal of the current rot.

I'm also proposing that public have more control over government.

MikeB4

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#1219929 22-Jan-2015 11:42

heylinb4nz:
KiwiNZ:
heylinb4nz:

You don't need to go back as far as 1775, and what makes you think that people in power today are any different ? the methods may have changed but they are still fallible to taking advantage of their population.

RE: Police legislating, they may not write \ sign off the legislation themselves but they are the ones that come up with the basis and for it to serve their agenda, and how quickly you forget the MSSA thumbhole stock saga, or the hand in policy, police policy sold to the public as law, even used our own money to advertise it. The judge in the case even quoted Police are there to enforce law not to make it.

honestly, you are just writing fantasy, unless I am missing the action of our totalitarian regime we have here.

As for military style rifles? the only place for them is in the hands of the military.

Oh hear we go. "My son was in the army so I know all about firearms" . Dont even get me started on NZ Police definition of MSSA and the misguided legislation they have forced onto us trying to control these so called "Evil Guns".

Dont misquote.

And again for the last time The Police DO NOT LEGISLATE that is done by the fine folks that occupy the fine buildings on Bowen and Molesworth streets

heylinb4nz

656 posts

Ultimate Geek
Inactive user

#1219938 22-Jan-2015 11:46

KiwiNZ:
heylinb4nz:
KiwiNZ:
heylinb4nz:

You don't need to go back as far as 1775, and what makes you think that people in power today are any different ? the methods may have changed but they are still fallible to taking advantage of their population.

RE: Police legislating, they may not write \ sign off the legislation themselves but they are the ones that come up with the basis and for it to serve their agenda, and how quickly you forget the MSSA thumbhole stock saga, or the hand in policy, police policy sold to the public as law, even used our own money to advertise it. The judge in the case even quoted Police are there to enforce law not to make it.

honestly, you are just writing fantasy, unless I am missing the action of our totalitarian regime we have here.

As for military style rifles? the only place for them is in the hands of the military.

Oh hear we go. "My son was in the army so I know all about firearms" . Dont even get me started on NZ Police definition of MSSA and the misguided legislation they have forced onto us trying to control these so called "Evil Guns".

Dont misquote.

And again for the last time The Police DO NOT LEGISLATE that is done by the fine folks that occupy the fine buildings on Bowen and Molesworth streets

Read the case LINCOLN vs NZ Police and tell me that police didn't try to pass off policy as law (legislation).

MikeB4

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#1219967 22-Jan-2015 12:09

heylinb4nz:

Read the case LINCOLN vs NZ Police and tell me that police didn't try to pass off policy as law (legislation).

I think you need to do some reading about how Government Departments and Agencies go about developing policy and procedures to implement the legislation that the Government of the day requires.

dickytim

2514 posts

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#1219988 22-Jan-2015 12:22

heylinb4nz:
KiwiNZ:
heylinb4nz:
raytaylor:
heylinb4nz: http://www.stuff.co.nz/waikato-times/news/64937416/Whakatane-cop-not-charged-over-dog-shooting

I wonder what would happen in the exact same case with a civilian ? or if the bow and arrow was swapped with say an Air Rifle ?.

I think that when the police decide not to charge someone, a civilian should be able to hire a lawyer and continue to try and prosecute the offender in court, based on the evidence they can muster.

Pointless when you consider

a) they have limitless legal funding courtesy of your tax dollar
b) our judges are biased (or just muppets)
c) if the offender is a police officer, be prepared to have the case deliberately drawn out

Are you suggesting we do away with the following...
1. Government
2. The Police
3. The Courts

My mind boggles at your posts

No i'm suggesting that we need a complete re-look at our justice system, police policies, much of our criminal and firearms legislation. Im talking an overhaul and removal of the current rot.

I'm also proposing that public have more control over government.

Luckily a higher percentage of the population disagree with you.

Note to self I really must stop reading threads you either start or contribute to.

heylinb4nz

656 posts

Ultimate Geek
Inactive user

#1220010 22-Jan-2015 12:34

dickytim:
heylinb4nz:
KiwiNZ:
heylinb4nz:
raytaylor:
heylinb4nz: http://www.stuff.co.nz/waikato-times/news/64937416/Whakatane-cop-not-charged-over-dog-shooting

I wonder what would happen in the exact same case with a civilian ? or if the bow and arrow was swapped with say an Air Rifle ?.

I think that when the police decide not to charge someone, a civilian should be able to hire a lawyer and continue to try and prosecute the offender in court, based on the evidence they can muster.

Pointless when you consider

a) they have limitless legal funding courtesy of your tax dollar
b) our judges are biased (or just muppets)
c) if the offender is a police officer, be prepared to have the case deliberately drawn out

Are you suggesting we do away with the following...
1. Government
2. The Police
3. The Courts

My mind boggles at your posts

No i'm suggesting that we need a complete re-look at our justice system, police policies, much of our criminal and firearms legislation. Im talking an overhaul and removal of the current rot.

I'm also proposing that public have more control over government.

Luckily a higher percentage of the population disagree with you.

Note to self I really must stop reading threads you either start or contribute to.

I least I contribute, havent seen your username on here before.

heylinb4nz

656 posts

Ultimate Geek
Inactive user

#1220011 22-Jan-2015 12:35

KiwiNZ:
heylinb4nz:

Read the case LINCOLN vs NZ Police and tell me that police didn't try to pass off policy as law (legislation).

I think you need to do some reading about how Government Departments and Agencies go about developing policy and procedures to implement the legislation that the Government of the day requires.

I think you need to look past your own nose.

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