Titanic tourist sub missing

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#3093581 22-Jun-2023 16:55

networkn:

Handsomedan:

I don't understand why a vessel like this is not tethered to a mothership on the surface, for these exact reasons.

It's not a massive vessel - it's not foolproof and it's going super deep.

Quite shocking, really (to a layman).

Was discussed earlier in the thread. 4KM Tether has a high likelihood of getting snagged or tangled on something.

Imagine the weight of 4km of steel cable of sufficient strength would be rather significant too.

neb

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#3093587 22-Jun-2023 17:14

frankv:
Sonobuoys are used by the air force to track submarines, which are being as stealthy quiet as they can be, and certainly not banging. Also, there's a string of hydrophones across the North Atlantic for tracking Russian subs. They heard the USS Scorpion explode off the Azores

That's been discussed in other forums, the gist of it was (a) those track things at depths of maybe 150m or so (although subs can go a bit deeper than that, 150m is apparently a typical travelling depth), (b) the network has been allowed to run down an awful lot since the end of the cold war, and (c) what's needed to detect a submarine trying not to be heard at 150m is very different from a submersible at 3,800m. It's sort of like asking a broadcast AM radio at 1200kHz to pick up an FM transmission at 97MHz.

heavenlywild

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#3093611 22-Jun-2023 18:32

Can someone tell me why this regular knocking sound every 30 mins is considered a possible sound coming from the sub?

If it is heard at random intervals it would sound to me more plausible as humans knocking vs every 30 mins.

Am I missing something?

Rikkitic

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#3093616 22-Jun-2023 18:48

heavenlywild: Can someone tell me why this regular knocking sound every 30 mins is considered a possible sound coming from the sub?

If it is heard at random intervals it would sound to me more plausible as humans knocking vs every 30 mins.

Am I missing something?

This has been explained in different places. Apparently it is standard military procedure for such cases. It is designed to be distinctive from any possible naturally occurring sound. It also creates a quiet space for any return message. That is my understanding at least.

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

Bung

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#3093617 22-Jun-2023 18:49

Banging at 30 min intervals is the sos signal. There is already enough random noise.

heavenlywild

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#3093618 22-Jun-2023 18:53

Thank you all for sharing. You learn something new every day.

heavenlywild

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#3093619 22-Jun-2023 18:57

And why wasn't it tethered?

Would have been relatively easy to do so?

Either way it's a tragedy. A very sad situation.

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Canuckabroad

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#3093678 22-Jun-2023 19:08

heavenlywild: And why wasn't it tethered?

Would have been relatively easy to do so?

Either way it's a tragedy. A very sad situation.

If you read back a few comments there was a discussion about tethering starting 6 comments ago.

tl/dr a 4km long tether is too heavy, too unwieldy, and too dangerous.

gzt

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#3093685 22-Jun-2023 20:01

Another failure scenario is some problem with ballast and sub could ascend only partially say 2km up or some number. After that it's all about battery, range, current, drift and all that. I have not heard this scenario discussed in media.

gzt

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#3093687 22-Jun-2023 20:10

Possibly detectable - unexpected underwater wave action:

USA Today (2014): Underwater waves move at a ponderous 6 to 7 mph, but their leisurely pace conceals their immense power. Submariners during World War II knew to avoid the Strait of Gibraltar, famed for its internal waves, says David Farmer, a physical oceanographer at the University of Rhode Island. In the 1980s, a Soviet submarine smashed into the bottom of a container ship, presumably because an internal wave tossed the sub as if it were a bath toy. Internal waves have threatened offshore oil-drilling rigs, and the stretches of calm water they create have bedeviled sailors.

an unlikely scenario until proven otherwise.

eracode

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#3093695 22-Jun-2023 20:44

kingdragonfly:

If I was trapped in submarine underwater, especially if I had a limited air supply, I'd be tapping more often than once every 30 minutes.

The whole point of banging every 30 mins is that it’s an accepted marine rescue protocol. Banging at random times and more frequently makes the noise less distinguishable from background noise so would not be a smart idea.

Sometimes I just sit and think. Other times I just sit.

kingdragonfly

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#3093697 22-Jun-2023 20:46

Submersible Titan, Titanic and Safety of Life at Sea (SOLAS) | Are Submersibles Regulated?

What is Going on With Shipping?

Jase2985

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#3093703 22-Jun-2023 21:08

eracode:

The whole point of banging every 30 mins is that it’s an accepted marine rescue protocol. Banging at random times and more frequently makes the noise less distinguishable from background noise so would not be a smart idea.

citation please

eracode

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#3093705 22-Jun-2023 21:20

Jase2985:

eracode:

The whole point of banging every 30 mins is that it’s an accepted marine rescue protocol. Banging at random times and more frequently makes the noise less distinguishable from background noise so would not be a smart idea.

citation please

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-06-22/explainer-noises-detected-oceangate-titanic-submersible/102509268

https://www.reddit.com/r/submarines/comments/14f0wrc/searchers_detect_banging_every_30_minutes_near/

And particularly this one:

https://www.lbc.co.uk/news/titanic-submarine-banging-heard-rescue/

“ … they've been using a naval protocol that's used by submarine survivors of disabled submarines around the world, in that on the hour and the half hour for three minutes they bang the hull and make as much noise as they can.”

(Frank Owen, a retired submarine commander in the Royal Australian Navy and former director of that country's Submarine Escape and Rescue Project).

Sometimes I just sit and think. Other times I just sit.

duckDecoy

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#3093709 22-Jun-2023 21:36

Canuckabroad:

heavenlywild: And why wasn't it tethered?

Would have been relatively easy to do so?

Either way it's a tragedy. A very sad situation.

If you read back a few comments there was a discussion about tethering starting 6 comments ago.

tl/dr a 4km long tether is too heavy, too unwieldy, and too dangerous.

I watched a YT from a woman who does scientific subs all day every day and she said tethers that long are not actually a problem if you don't expect to snag anything PROVIDED the topside weather is good and the boat it is tethered to isn't bouncing up and down. But the boat it launched from didn't have the capability to have a tether, which she considered as negligent.

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