Should New Zealand invest in nuclear power plants?

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#3228815 10-May-2024 17:39

mattwnz:

Being in an earthquake zone, and seeing what happened in Japan with Fukushima, no. Although if one were to be built, Auckland would be where it would need to be built. NZ has many other options that are renewable and safe including wind, PV geothermal and hydro. The biggest problems NZ has is increasing the population significantly in a very short period of time, without investing in infrastructure, and this goes far beyond electricity. EV sales have dropped through the floor and it will take a very long time to switch to an EV fleet baed on current numbers. Many people are instead going the hybrid route. Many people will end up installing solar on their roofs too. One of the big problems IMO has been the resource management act and all the red tape and costs to build infrastructure. UK only generates about 15% from nuclear, so it isn't a miracle solution, otherwise they would have most of their generation via nuclear.

Auckland and everywhere north is not an earthquake zone, is it?

update: earthquake zones

MikeB4

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#3228818 10-May-2024 17:42

@johno1234 the subduction zone off the East coast means no area Aotearoa is safe from earthquakes.

johno1234

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#3228821 10-May-2024 17:46

Says who?

When I search this, I find only the opposite and that there are no active faults. The East Coast fault is hundreds of miles away. I would be far more concerned about tsunami in low lying areas?

Any earthquake that damages Northland will probably destroy the rest of NZ.

tdgeek

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#3228823 10-May-2024 17:50

IMHO, yes. Chernobyl and Three Mile Island were an obvious problem. But nuclear is clean burning. Yes there are disposal issues but if we can land a a probe on a comet or asteroid and bring samples back, we can find a solution for nuclear waste that will bridge the gap to full solar energy, and latterly, fusion

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#3228825 10-May-2024 17:52

SATTV:

It does not help that we have about 750MW down for maintenance at the moment, I would have thought maintenance would have been done in the warmer months when less power is needed.

NZ does need to invest in its infrastructure, I can’t see too many more hydro dams going in, wind is not as green as you think and solar is a long way off being a viable candidate.

The next thing we should do is waste to energy, a friend of mines, brother-in-law converts coal stations in the UK to burn rubbish, apparently it is cleaner than coal by a long shot, it gets so hot in the furnace it just disintegrates most things.

I saw something on the internet a few days ago ( so it must be true ) that Singapore has four waste to energy plants for a good chank of its electricity generation.

As much as I don’t like it I think we will have to go nuclear in our lifetime, I have heard of these small floating plants that they anchor off shore and run a cable, I think this is a good idea, have more smaller ones rather than one or two large ones.

John

Not trying to be funny NZ does need to invest in its infrastructure, but we dont as that boring as hell topic doesnt buy votes. But I do agree, the trip is getting voters to agree

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#3228826 10-May-2024 17:55

MrBBEye:

Big no for the Shakey Isles, EQ risk is too great. Upgrading transmission lines should be the first priority.

Who pays? Not disagreeing, but who pays?

tweake

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#3228827 10-May-2024 17:57

Jase2985:

Not sure where you have been looking

https://www.energycouncil.com.au/news/international-electricity-price-comparisons/

just having a look, its unclear if that strictly kwh prices or if it includes all the other add on charges.

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MikeB4

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#3228829 10-May-2024 18:00

@johno1234 When(not if) the subduction zone slips it expected to generate a earthquake(s)It will probably cause other faults to fire. at magnitude 8 plus. GNS science has lots of data.

tdgeek

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#3228830 10-May-2024 18:00

sir1963:

we should also go back to hot water cylinders but with passive thermal panels to heat the water, again reducing the need for power.

we should be subsiding solar panels to put on housing

we should also be investing in battery storage (the new Sodium batteries look good ).

We also need to improve home insulation.

Those things could mostly eliminate housing as an energy consumer.

And dare I say it, but heating larger buildings by burning scrap wood and forest slash ( NOT adding additional CO2 into the atmosphere, it is actually recycling)

We have solar HW, its awesome. 8k in 2011 less EECA subsidy to about 5.5k, includes 300L two element cylinder, LCD panel to manage it. We cannot get solar PV due to our "intricate roof" but while Solar PV has cost/benefit issues, solar HW doesnt as its cheap to install. IIRC hot water is 40% of a power bill. Ours is off grid 8 months a year (yes we do have one hour free via EK for a HW cylinder top up)

mattwnz

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#3228831 10-May-2024 18:01

johno1234:

mattwnz:

Being in an earthquake zone, and seeing what happened in Japan with Fukushima, no. Although if one were to be built, Auckland would be where it would need to be built. NZ has many other options that are renewable and safe including wind, PV geothermal and hydro. The biggest problems NZ has is increasing the population significantly in a very short period of time, without investing in infrastructure, and this goes far beyond electricity. EV sales have dropped through the floor and it will take a very long time to switch to an EV fleet baed on current numbers. Many people are instead going the hybrid route. Many people will end up installing solar on their roofs too. One of the big problems IMO has been the resource management act and all the red tape and costs to build infrastructure. UK only generates about 15% from nuclear, so it isn't a miracle solution, otherwise they would have most of their generation via nuclear.

Auckland and everywhere north is not an earthquake zone, is it?

update: earthquake zones

Before the Chch earthquakes, Chch wasn't seen as a major earthquake risk. Wellington and Hawkes bay were always seen as the high risk areas. But as I said, Auckland would be the place to build it if it has to go somewhere, although they do also have volcanic risk. But it is a massive cost to build and run and it isn't a magic solution. I just wonder how we were able to build significant hydro supply that we are still using, with relatively old technologies and machinery, without bankrupting the country..

Jase2985

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#3228832 10-May-2024 18:03

mattwnz:

If it needs a plan, then the buy prices could be used to offset the sell back price, to make the sell back prices seem higher. But the sell back price is only around 1/4 to 1/3 the price the consumer buys it at, which is poor IMO

again shop around, mine is about 1/2 of my peak rate and the same as my off peak rate.

tdgeek

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#3228833 10-May-2024 18:05

rb99:

Personally I'd nationalize all the power companies, then maybe we'd actually get some joined up thinking.

1000%

Power is akin to air, food and water, a neccesity, it should be a non profit business, i.e run by the Govt for the people

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#3228836 10-May-2024 18:13

networkn:

Last time I started a thread like this I was shouted down by all the people who seem unable to differentiate between nuclear weapons and nuclear power, and/or saying that it would never work because of the geological make up of NZ and it's it's various earthquake fault lines and other things.

I was very enthusiastic about it after seeing a Ted talk about a guy comparing the ecological and impact to wildlife of both Solar and Wind, and comparing how much of that you would need to compete with one of the 'new' mini reactors which are cooled by sand rather than water.

Yes a Nuclear disaster would be terrible, and yes, we have seen some go really badly, but the power even a tiny one can produce is amazing. Even a small one in each Island would change the way energy works in NZ.

I am not a geologist, nor a nuclear science, but it seems to be there would be a safe place to put one on each island somewhere

Very much agree. Chernobyl was a Russian amateur failure. Fukushima was a surprising failure due to Japans EQ history over time (like ours). Three Mile Island Im unsure what happened there.

But Im sure we can locate and use 2024 tech to make it work. Nuclear has been common and boring in Europe forever, its now fallen out of favour due to Fukushima.

An ideal move until we get to 100% green energy. 100% being 24/7 365 days a year.

DjShadow

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#3228838 10-May-2024 18:15

Late to this thread, but in short yes I support Nuclear Energy if done safely.

A big renewal energy source to consider is the cook strait with the constant current running through it, its depth could however be an issue.

Another big energy use to consider is the Data Centres that Microsoft, Amazon and Google are building in NZ, this story says Data Centre power use would hit 303 Megawatt by 2030.

tdgeek

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#3228839 10-May-2024 18:16

Batman:

if you want to not be dependent on fossil fuels yes but risk total annihilation cue fukushima. if you want to be dependent on fossil fuels, i think we should start drilling or be at the mercy of the big oil sending refined oil to the edge of the planet.

PS have we not yes mastered how to harness the energy of the sea waves?

Im still alive. It was a disaster caused by humans, but we humans see still alive.

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