So the Studios are going to go after Kiwis

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MikeB4

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#171218 10-Apr-2015 09:03

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/67657478/us-movie-studio-threatens-kiwi-film-pirates

This will interesting as it plays out, and controversial

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#1280214 10-Apr-2015 09:19

So they learned lots from watching the music industry then.....

ubergeeknz

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#1280218 10-Apr-2015 09:23

That's not what I read from the article at all. In fact they were rather non-committal.

In any case, as I understand it, the only remedy they really have available here is the "three strikes" mechanism which won't stack up for them.

vexxxboy

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#1280224 10-Apr-2015 09:25

theres a reason why they are doing it in Australia because the courts in the USA have told the studios that just having a name attached to an ISP address is not enough , they have to prove it was that person who downloaded it and that's really hard and next to impossible to prove, so they are moving to countries where the burden of proof is a lot less .

Common sense is not as common as you think.

sidefx

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#1280225 10-Apr-2015 09:25

So... they mention skynet later in the article, but it looks like they're going to try and go around it by taking it to court and try to force ISPs to hand over names straight away, without going through the 3 strike process? Hah, good luck. There's an existing process and laws in place already which seem pretty well defined for a reason surely?

EDIT: If this is indeed their plan, then it just goes to show the studios aren't actually interested in stopping piracy as such (which going through the three strike process probably would - for a small fee - most people not "in the know" around VPNs etc would probably stop upon getting the first letter or would stop if they heard their friends were getting letters)

Instead, it seems they're just trolling for ridiculous damages payments...

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ubergeeknz

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#1280227 10-Apr-2015 09:27

sidefx: So... they mention skynet later in the article, but it looks like they're going to try and go around it by taking it to court and try to force ISPs to hand over names straight away, without going through the 3 strike process? Hah, good luck. There's an existing process and laws in place already which seem pretty well defined for a reason surely?

This is exactly why the law was created. It reads to me as if they haven't even explored NZ yet. Why would they with bigger and more lucrative targets still underway?

BTR

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#1280230 10-Apr-2015 09:28

Don't break the law you and don't have anything to worry about then.

sidefx

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#1280250 10-Apr-2015 09:38

BTR: Don't break the law you and don't have anything to worry about then.

This has been rehashed so many times on here it's not funny... I guess once more won't hurt. As the article alludes to many people feel that the pricing and delay in getting content in NZ isn't (or perhaps "wasn't", because it has improved a fair bit recently) reasonable. So yes they break the law and pirate content to get it. Some perhaps feel this is a silent form of protest. But I think the recent popularity of lightbox, netflix, etc shows that most Kiwis are completely happy to pay for content if it's priced reasonably and convenient, etc. So instead of litigating studios should really be focusing on getting content to people in a convenient, reasonably priced way. Suing your (potential) customers and their families is just idiotic.

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SaltyNZ

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#1280258 10-Apr-2015 09:47

sidefx:
BTR: Don't break the law you and don't have anything to worry about then.

This has been rehashed so many times on here it's not funny... I guess once more won't hurt. As the article alludes to many people feel that the pricing and delay in getting content in NZ isn't (or perhaps "wasn't", because it has improved a fair bit recently) reasonable. So yes they break the law and pirate content to get it. Some perhaps feel this is a silent form of protest. But I think the recent popularity of lightbox, netflix, etc shows that most Kiwis are completely happy to pay for content if it's priced reasonably and convenient, etc. So instead of litigating studios should really be focusing on getting content to people in a convenient, reasonably priced way. Suing your (potential) customers and their families is just idiotic.

Also re-re-re-rehashed many times, but: more importantly than that, just because 'you' had an IP address at the time an alleged infringement occurred doesn't mean you did it, or even knew it was happening. We don't hold you responsible if a thief steals your car and uses it to rob a bank. But we're perfectly OK with holding you responsible if someone uses your internet connection to download a movie.

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wellygary

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#1280550 10-Apr-2015 15:19

ubergeeknz:
sidefx: So... they mention skynet later in the article, but it looks like they're going to try and go around it by taking it to court and try to force ISPs to hand over names straight away, without going through the 3 strike process? Hah, good luck. There's an existing process and laws in place already which seem pretty well defined for a reason surely?

This is exactly why the law was created. It reads to me as if they haven't even explored NZ yet. Why would they with bigger and more lucrative targets still underway?

+1 , The courts tend to take a dim view of being asked to sort out matters when there are existing legislative processes to solve a particular issue

The original Stuff article certainly appears to be alarmist and I suspect the US based company might be un-informed as to the actual legislative situation in NZ

NonprayingMantis

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#1280584 10-Apr-2015 15:51

Dallas Buyers Club:
full cinema release date USA: 22 Nov 2014
full cinema release NZ: 20 Feb 2014

DVD release USA: 4 Feb 2014
DVD release NZ: 16 July 2014

Not terribly surprising that people pirated it.

I remember somebody suggesting before that, since the court awards damages for pirated content, if the content wasn't actually legally available in NZ then there could be no damages suffered and so the fine should be minimal.

NonprayingMantis

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#1280587 10-Apr-2015 15:58

SaltyNZ:
sidefx:
BTR: Don't break the law you and don't have anything to worry about then.

This has been rehashed so many times on here it's not funny... I guess once more won't hurt. As the article alludes to many people feel that the pricing and delay in getting content in NZ isn't (or perhaps "wasn't", because it has improved a fair bit recently) reasonable. So yes they break the law and pirate content to get it. Some perhaps feel this is a silent form of protest. But I think the recent popularity of lightbox, netflix, etc shows that most Kiwis are completely happy to pay for content if it's priced reasonably and convenient, etc. So instead of litigating studios should really be focusing on getting content to people in a convenient, reasonably priced way. Suing your (potential) customers and their families is just idiotic.

Also re-re-re-rehashed many times, but: more importantly than that, just because 'you' had an IP address at the time an alleged infringement occurred doesn't mean you did it, or even knew it was happening. We don't hold you responsible if a thief steals your car and uses it to rob a bank. But we're perfectly OK with holding you responsible if someone uses your internet connection to download a movie.

whilst that is true, the law seems to 'assume' guilt in the case of things like speeding.

i.e. if I am driving my friend's car and get caught by a speed camera then he will get the fine, not me. If I refuse to admit it and he can't prove that it wasn't him driving, then he will have to pay up.

For that matter, parking companies also assume guilt. If a car is parked 'wrongly', the D-bags at tournament parking will issue a ticket. Even if you didn't park there and it was your friend that did it, they will still chase you for payment and tale you to baycorp etc

reven

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#1280605 10-Apr-2015 16:20

NonprayingMantis: Dallas Buyers Club:
full cinema release date USA: 22 Nov 2014
full cinema release NZ: 20 Feb 2014

DVD release USA: 4 Feb 2014
DVD release NZ: 16 July 2014

Not terribly surprising that people pirated it.

I remember somebody suggesting before that, since the court awards damages for pirated content, if the content wasn't actually legally available in NZ then there could be no damages suffered and so the fine should be minimal.

full cinema release date USA: 22 Nov 2013
full cinema release NZ: 20 Feb 2014

:D

I think I grabbed a uv code for the movie for like $4.

ubergeeknz

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#1280607 10-Apr-2015 16:29

NonprayingMantis: For that matter, parking companies also assume guilt. If a car is parked 'wrongly', the D-bags at tournament parking will issue a ticket. Even if you didn't park there and it was your friend that did it, they will still chase you for payment and tale you to baycorp etc

You know these "tickets" are not legally binding right? Don't pay it. Just contest it and offer reasonable damages.

MikeB4

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#1280608 10-Apr-2015 16:30

reven:
NonprayingMantis: Dallas Buyers Club:
full cinema release date USA: 22 Nov 2014
full cinema release NZ: 20 Feb 2014

DVD release USA: 4 Feb 2014
DVD release NZ: 16 July 2014

Not terribly surprising that people pirated it.

I remember somebody suggesting before that, since the court awards damages for pirated content, if the content wasn't actually legally available in NZ then there could be no damages suffered and so the fine should be minimal.

full cinema release date USA: 22 Nov 2013
full cinema release NZ: 20 Feb 2014

:D

I think I grabbed a uv code for the movie for like $4.

They need to swap from litigation to innovation

sidefx

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#1280621 10-Apr-2015 17:32

KiwiNZ:
They need to swap from litigation to innovation

Totally this. The ironic thing is that persisting with their old behaviour and continuing to try and force people to only consume content on their terms, following their timelines and with silly regional pricing, the major studios have almost trained a whole generation that pirating is the most convenient and cheap way to get content... If I torrent a movie I get a completely DRM free copy that I can keep forever, format shift as I like, is often encoded and compressed better than the studios manage left to their own devices, and doesn't force me to sit through 10 minutes of scaremongering telling me how I'm like a burglar, car thief or mugger...

(EDIT: I should say I'm not completely against DRM as long as it's unobtrusive and "just works" - unfortunately the two are often mutually exclusive it seems...)

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