Fry for better broadband, any time now...

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#584931 22-Feb-2012 07:50

raytaylor: If anyone wants to look at the average uncapped usage of the average NZ household is, why not just ask slingshot?

I know i can download torrents at line speed (1.7 mBytes per second), they cache EVERYTHING including video, youtube, torrents, p2p, so its all super fast.
And when you are downloading something uncached from an international source, its fast anyway because of all the leftover bandwidth they have from not needing to serve content directly.

So basically there is a model in place right now that we can refer to - just ask a whole bunch of uni students who have their flat hooked up to slingshot AYCE and see what their usage is.

On slingshots behalf, the AYCE system was a huge gamble that i think is paying off well. They must have spent hundreds of thousands of dollars on the caching systems and i wouldnt be surprised if the call plus business centre is just one big giant squid cache.

you can't, because that won't be the average. It will be the subset of people who desire shedloads of data but aren't wiling to pay for it. In other words, the average for slingshots AYCE plan will be skewed significantly upwards from the true average if everybody was uncapped.

Better to look at average usage for countries where every provider (or nearly every provider) has unlimited plans and see the average there. We've alreayd done that in this thread and turns out the raverage isn't all that high - 20-30GB, and if you were to remove the vampires from that average then it is probably closer to 15GB, which is roughtly the NZ average anyway.

Behodar

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#584935 22-Feb-2012 08:05

When TelstraClear had the unlimited weekend a couple of months ago, a press release listed the number of customers that used it and the total data usage. From memory it worked out at about 30 GB per user, and even that is undoubtedly skewed higher than usual due to people rushing to download before the weekend was over.

itxtme

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#584968 22-Feb-2012 09:25

sbiddle:
StevieT:
sbiddle: I'm still waiting for evidence our caps are hampering the average NZers broadband usage. Nobody has yet presented me with a compelling case as to how that is occuring.

In the US it's pretty much the norm now to find "unlimited" connections (which are the norm) from all major players to be capped at ~250GB. Despite this, average broadband usage in the US is roughly 20GB per month. Predictions from various sources predict this will hit ~60GB by 2015. This figure still represents the average user using 1/4 of their monthly cap.

Here in NZ estimates seem to put the average monthly usage at somewhere between 10GB to 15GB now. Nobody I've spoken to seems to have an accurate figure of what this is, but it's safe to say it's doubled from the ~6GB that was talked about around a year ago.

Sure we have plenty of people using 60GB + per month. I know people who use 100 GB + per month, but getting back to averages I fail to see how the average NZer's use of the internet is being hampered by caps.

You can't present a compelling case for the average NZ basing their data usage on the average of everyones data usage. I fail to see how calculating such an average would even indicate it is an average NZer's usage.

Let's sum it up a better way.

Americans have "unlimited" data plans with ~250GB caps pretty much as the norm. They use 20GB per month on average.

Here in NZ we use upwards of ~15GB on average (with seemingly no industry established figure at this time).

If Americans can't manage to chew through significantly more data despite being the hope of torrenting and on demand video what makes us think we all need "unlimited" caps and are being short changed?

Aaah the average, that special number in which large numbers are written off immediately based on the extremes!!!! Averages make for good arguments, but without real data analysis mean nothing. Just saw an article on this whole debacle this morning at Stuff

Netflix's Christchurch-born vice-president, Brent Ayrey, said in November that meagre data caps were one factor preventing the popular United States online movie and television service launching in New Zealand.The average customer in the US consumed a terabyte each month.

Theres a new average to throw in there!

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#584978 22-Feb-2012 09:37

itxtme:
Netflix's Christchurch-born vice-president, Brent Ayrey, said in November that meagre data caps were one factor preventing the popular United States online movie and television service launching in New Zealand.The average customer in the US consumed a terabyte each month.
Theres a new average to throw in there!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sYSplsvJ45Y

stevenz

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#584994 22-Feb-2012 09:55

A terabyte!? How much TV are these people watching?

Given that Netflix apparently needs at most 3.8Mbps (http://blog.netflix.com/2008/11/encoding-for-streaming.html) for HD material, if that's taken to be the baseline for _all_ video streamed from them, then that'd equate to over 500 hours of viewing per household/month if my maths is correct (caveat: It probably isn't).

Edit:
Found a more up-to-date reference:http://technologizer.com/2011/06/23/got-bandwidth-caps-netflix-has-you-covered/

2.3GB/hour equates to roughly 5Mbps. That's still > 400 hours of TV.

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#585000 22-Feb-2012 10:05

stevenz: A terabyte!? How much TV are these people watching?

Given that Netflix apparently needs at most 3.8Mbps (http://blog.netflix.com/2008/11/encoding-for-streaming.html) for HD material, if that's taken to be the baseline for _all_ video streamed from them, then that'd equate to over 500 hours of viewing per household/month if my maths is correct (caveat: It probably isn't).

Now that I have watched this video I think the overall adoption of Netflix would be the killer if it was launched in NZ.

Netflix accounts for 32.7% of all US traffic.

crackrdbycracku

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#585003 22-Feb-2012 10:08

NonprayingMantis: found this quote fromStephen Fry pretty funny

"[he]said a "smart guy" could make "a fortune and a fool of the complacent Telecomm [sic] and their contemptuous attitude to customers. Phew! Rant over"."

so he is basically implying that all of telecom's competitors are incompetent because they don't give everyone unlimited data.

The more I think about the more Fry reminds me of Kiwis who go on holiday to London and when they return home complain about the cost of beer in pubs set up for tourists. Wow, what a surprise.

I think he is just moaning that 'things aren't like back home'. I easily imagine, but I'm not saying this for sure, he was given a house when he landed and it had some basic plan on because it isn't lived in all the time. Sure, it didn't meet his needs.

With regard to Telecom's service I've been to the UK, service isn't their strong suit.

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freitasm

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#585011 22-Feb-2012 10:20

The whole "1TB" Netflix is not factual - the information was passed from Netflix sources to Paul Brislen who passed to Stuff. Paul is not sure it's individual or residence numbers. Other sources say average broadband per household in the US is about 30GB.

itxtme

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#585035 22-Feb-2012 10:44

freitasm: The whole "1TB" Netflix is not factual - the information was passed from Netflix sources to Paul Brislen who passed to Stuff. Paul is not sure it's individual or residence numbers. Other sources say average broadband per household in the US is about 30GB.

My impression was that he was quoting the average user use on their network? Granted it is a bit of a one sided source!

Beccara

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#585039 22-Feb-2012 10:52

This is what my household of 2 people and a 5 year child looks like in useage, This is Netflix HD streaming of atleast 1 movie a night, Sponge bob episodes etc etc for the child when shes home from school, Hulu for TV - normally a couple of episodes each day, Spotify streaming in the kitchen and torrenting whatever I cant get on NetFlix and Hulu.

Once you get past the "DOWNLOAD EVERYTHING!" phase usage becomes more normal, The 250gb cap in the picture doesn't actually kick in for me but this gives me everything I need and want. Some months I'll hit 220gb.

Netflix does account for a HUGE amount of the traffic in the USA but it's mainly because they have a HUGE number of clients

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#585041 22-Feb-2012 10:52

And it goes back to the cap "feature".

There are no cap plans around in New Zealand. You want no cap, get a no cap plan. You want to limit your exposure to unknown bill ("bill shock") get a cap plan with a fixed payment.

Now, saying the whole New Zealand needs no cap plan because some people are avid digital video consumers is a bit too much. There are options out there, use them.

freitasm

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#586860 26-Feb-2012 08:50

Oh, my! I think Mr Fry is living in the wrong planet then. And everyone else...

Almost 50 per cent of UK suffers from super slow broadband.

mattbush

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#586865 26-Feb-2012 09:38

freitasm: Oh, my! I think Mr Fry is living in the wrong planet then. And everyone else...

Almost 50 per cent of UK suffers from super slow broadband.

you seem to have it for Mr Fry....

You are I believe on probably on one the fastest home broadband plans available, so are probably unable to understand what the average(non cable) user has to put up with.

I am an online gamer and I know how bad my friends have it on adsl compared to my cable.

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#586872 26-Feb-2012 09:56

mattbush: You are I believe on probably on one the fastest home broadband plans available, so are probably unable to understand what the average(non cable) user has to put up with.

I am an online gamer and I know how bad my friends have it on adsl compared to my cable.

Have you checked your home wiring yet? Have you checked if you are in the right plan/configuration if connected to a cabinet yet?

tdgeek

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#586873 26-Feb-2012 09:57

My take is:

Many in NZ have access to BB
Many have a sound connect rate
DSL is distance limited

If a splitter was mandatory (it is an excellent investment) then I feel that would reduce users issues, increase speed, and give a much better comparison of "real" DSL performance.

But no, thats too much $, the issues I have are ISP/NZ fault. If a user wants to spend $500 to $1200 p.a. on BB then a one off splitter cost is well worth it. Look at it as $15 per month for one year, or cheaper if you get an electrician to do it.

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