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Topic # 119664 9-Jun-2013 19:24
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Just been reading this about the new xbox one's DRM features
Specifically
You can buy a game. To sell it, you must have been registered friends with the buyer for 30 days.
The buyer cannot onsell it again.

Does this break our consumer protection law in NZ?

http://www.dslreports.com/shownews/Xbox-One-DRM-About-as-Bad-As-Leaks-Suggested-124548




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  Reply # 833195 9-Jun-2013 19:44
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Interesting question. The whole situation doesn't bother me much as I tend to keep all the games I buy anyway. I've traded a couple at EB a long time ago, but by and large I just buy the games I know will have replayability and keep them.

What I do wonder about is how this will effect the rental market via United Video etc. Will we no longer be able to spend $7 to rent a game for the night to see if it's something we'll like before spending $80+ to buy it? Will they insist on downloading demo's from Xbox Live instead?

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  Reply # 833198 9-Jun-2013 19:47
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why would iot break consumer protection laws? could you be more specific?

there are already plenty of similar licence agreements around software. 

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  Reply # 833199 9-Jun-2013 19:48
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Surely all this new DRM will bring game prices down? LOL



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  Reply # 833206 9-Jun-2013 20:05
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I am not a gamer - other than solitare and sim city 2000.
But i am interested in the legal aspect of it.

I would have thought that a core component of consumer protection law in NZ would have been the concept of ownership and resale rights.
Eg. If i buy something, i should be allowed to sell it.

I may buy a car, but toyota cannot stop me from selling it on trademe.

So i guess that if my gamer flat mate were to buy a xbox one copy of grand theft auto, he is really only 'renting' it for an indefinite period of time.

I do believe it will screw over the video shops and i do believe the price of games will generally come down.
Eg. the $29-$69 games sold at the warehouse would still remain the same price. BUT there would be a new market for arcade games like angry birds for $2 to $10 that we see on android and ios - and i can see that as a positive thing by bringing it to the xbox platform.

I can understand if its a downloaded game - yes they may lock that in because its not a physical asset. But if you purchased a disc game from the warehouse, the game (more specifically the disc and its function) should be able to be onsold to new owners just like my car.




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  Reply # 833209 9-Jun-2013 20:12
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Reading this I guess the idea of heading down to Video Ezy to rent a game is over?

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  Reply # 833272 9-Jun-2013 22:01
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Interesting question.

I think it should be part of your rights when purchasing a product that you can sell it.

Although I don't think you can sell apps that you have bought, or sell for example games purchased on Steam.

So it might not be any different to how those systems work.

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  Reply # 833275 9-Jun-2013 22:07
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raytaylor: ... I would have thought that a core component of consumer protection law in NZ would have been the concept of ownership and resale rights.  Eg. If i buy something, i should be allowed to sell
it. ...


Nice idea, but surely you jest? Beer bottles & soft-drink glass bottles used to have something like ".. . remains the property of ... company" so this type of contractual reservation of property-rights has been around a long time. It will all be clarified when the TPP comes into operation :-)



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  Reply # 833284 9-Jun-2013 22:43
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I feel as though the rental games will still be a thing, as a rental dvd has a different header than a regular dvd, so can be detected as different.  The games will probably do that too?

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  Reply # 833290 9-Jun-2013 23:19
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the rental thing will be done via the cloud most likely, so rtather than going to a video shop[, you just live stream games with 2 days of access or something like that.

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  Reply # 833293 9-Jun-2013 23:29
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as for your rights to on-sell stuff, that depends. you certainly own anygame disc you buy, but your require a licence to use the software on that disc. so you can sell the disc onto someone else, but unless microsoft is willing to transfer the licence then they are well within their rights to block it from working if they choose to and have the ability.
historically they have never had the ability, but with an (almost) always on xbox they can do so.


really, its no different from any game you buy which uses steam. even if you buy a boxed copy it is not possible to activate it more than once. you cannot sell your copy of half life, for example, once it is registered to your steam account.

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  Reply # 833295 9-Jun-2013 23:43
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No different to not being able to sell any other app/game/software/licence/subscription, which are usually attached to a single account once activated.
In comparison to a lot of software, this Xbox One

The backlash for this seems overblown, but saying that as a PC user i dont have to pay stupidly high prices for games most of the time - and people probably want to sell it once their done to recover some of that cost.

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  Reply # 833306 10-Jun-2013 00:14
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Everything is DRM now days. Xbox Music, iTunes, Spotify, Steam and plenty more.

The funny thing is that if you read the current EULA of the games that you purchase, it even states that you are being granted a non exclusive, a limited right and non transferable license.

Nothing has actually changed.




Do whatever you want to do man.

  

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  Reply # 833320 10-Jun-2013 02:18
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macuser: I feel as though the rental games will still be a thing, as a rental dvd has a different header than a regular dvd, so can be detected as different.  The games will probably do that too?


This is not the case.

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  Reply # 833346 10-Jun-2013 08:32
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It would be good if you were able to rent online.
Say you wanted a more in-depth play than the demo allowed, a rental option would give you time to evaluate more fully.
Even better would be if that rental fee came off the price of the game if you chose to purchase it.
Doesn't iTunes offer something similar if you buy a single and then buy the rest of the album?

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  Reply # 833347 10-Jun-2013 08:37
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For the record, iTunes music has been DRM free since 2009. If you do believe it try importing your friends playlist.

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