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1904 posts

Uber Geek


# 214084 27-Apr-2017 11:35
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Hi Guys
Im after some options to get wifi reliable

Auckland CBD office, absolutely swamped by nearby offices BLASTING hi power wifi
Wifi analyser app shows many nearby wifi SSD's, at the same power level as the office in question, so those nearby
offices had the same issue & are just using stupidly high power to get their wifi going (I assume)
There are no clear channels to use.

 

The wifi works,sometimes, buts its just not reliable. Whatever I do I'll be battling with nearby offices, it could turn into a
transmit power war :-)
Any options? 

 

Perhaps try 5.8Ghz as the ONLY local wifi in the office ?, but even thats getting congested now.
Unfortunately, the office staff & management just want wifi to work , they dont really hear when you tell them them & show them
how congested wifi is locally .
All PC's are connected via cable, so its just for phones & for guest's laptops .

 

 

 

 

 

 


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28260 posts

Uber Geek

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  # 1771165 27-Apr-2017 11:40
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Sounds like the first step is to buy better equipment. What are you using?

 

 

 

 


975 posts

Ultimate Geek

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  # 1771166 27-Apr-2017 11:40
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Read this. Its just right:

 

https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2017/03/802-eleventy-what-a-deep-dive-into-why-wi-fi-kind-of-sucks/

 

So 5Ghz Options with High Quality Equipment that supports band steering is a good start. That is not blasting too loud. Turning down the transmit power and having MORE Access points is a bit of a general rule. Get LoS to the AP. 

 

And don't expect amazing speeds over wifi. use cable if you want to copy a lot of data. 

 

If some moneys are copying files over the LAN all day over the wifi then tell them not to do so and get a docking station for people that need to do that. 

 

Wifi should really only be used when you are roaming around the office. I use wifi in the board rooms and offices. Or if I am out on the deck in the sun.

 

At my desk, i have an ethernet cable plugged into my Mac Thunderbolt Monitor.


 
 
 
 




1904 posts

Uber Geek


  # 1771195 27-Apr-2017 12:13
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sbiddle:

 

Sounds like the first step is to buy better equipment. What are you using?

 

 

1) Microtek wifi router (ISP Supplied) . It worked fine on my Android when I tested it yesterday, staff are complaining
that its "not Working"

2) TPLink wifi router : In the previous building office (not CBD) it was good , with reason (range/walls etc)
They shifted to a another blding(CBD) , now its unreliable (for them)
Its hopeless in the wifi congested main office. So I put it in the
managers office, it works OK in there (his Walls blocking external wifi I guess) > Keeps the boss happy, thats allways the 1st step.

 

They would be happy to buy better equipment (within reason) , as long as it allways works. (not reasonable ?)
I dont want to recommend something , only to have that swamped by nearby companies wifi .
Saying wifi is a best effort, not a 100% platform comes across as an excuse

"wifi works perfectly at home "  "wifi works at my friends office "  etc

 

Most of them have newish Iphones , so should be AC compatable
That may be the next step to try, an wifi AC access point . & then turn off 2.4 to force them to use 5.8

 

Cheers

 

edit : the other thing to look into would be to monitor data usage on wifi, see if 1 user has constant/excesssive downloads ?

 

 


28260 posts

Uber Geek

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  # 1771223 27-Apr-2017 12:55
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How many devices?

 

 


751 posts

Ultimate Geek

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  # 1771224 27-Apr-2017 12:58
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Sounds like you need a wifi system. Not a single ap.

If there is a large surface area then a few ubiquiti Ac aps would work. Ideally wired into the network.

If smaller surface area. Maybe try netgear Orbi. Although it uses a wireless backhaul they have been very successful for me. Easy setup.

Get the pros in if you can't manage it.




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1904 posts

Uber Geek


  # 1771228 27-Apr-2017 13:02
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sbiddle:

 

How many devices?

 

 

approx 8 , assuming they all have ph's connecting to wifi . & allowing for say 1x guest laptop/ph.

Its a shared office (another company in same room), so the other company also has their own separate wifi AP (& separate fibre connection).

 

 


2672 posts

Uber Geek

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  # 1771229 27-Apr-2017 13:07
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The Ubiquiti UniFi range sounds like just the system you may need. Easy to set up, and manage remotely, and can monitor which wireless devices are using too much data. It has features such as Band Steering which steers devices to the 5G network if desired.




 
 
 
 




1904 posts

Uber Geek


  # 1771230 27-Apr-2017 13:10
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sdavisnz: Sounds like you need a wifi system. Not a single ap.

If there is a large surface area then a few ubiquiti Ac aps would work. Ideally wired into the network.

 

Its not a large area , open plan main office space that needs the wifi. Coverage isnt an issue .
 

 

I'll look at the unfi's , I can allways add more units with that system .



22496 posts

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  # 1771233 27-Apr-2017 13:28
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There is no always works with wifi. With the stupidity of it _still_ haveing unencrypted deauth frames, you are at the mercy on 2.4GHz of anyone with $3 for an esp8266 and a few mins to watch a youtube video on how to upload to it not wanting to "jam" your wifi.

 

Get on 5GHz if you can, if your devices are not junk and support the DFS channels, use those since they are largely clear still.

 

You have not paid for exclusive use of the spectrum, the other networks are not intentionally interfering with you so nothing you can really do other than move your gear away from them.





Richard rich.ms

228 posts

Master Geek


  # 1771238 27-Apr-2017 13:39
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You are up against a number of factors:

 

  • Unqualified people deploy wireless in corporate offices.  This means they blast it not realising that their throughput is reduced.
  • The 2.4 GHz spectrum is only three 20 MHz channels wide and in the Auckland CBD it is saturated.
  • The telcos are deploying LTE TDD (and equivalents) that are adding to the 2.4 GHz spectrum saturation.
  • Small companies deploy residential and SME equipment like Netgear, Netcomm, Ubiquiti, etc. and these don't perform well in these environments.

What is the square footage of your customer?

 

How many wireless users (worst case) to you need to support?

 

Which wireless clients are deployed? (Apple smartphones/tablets Android smartphones/tablets, Windows laptops, etc.)

 

What is your customer's expectation of the wireless network?  Do they want to web surf or run HD video?

 

What is your customer's budget to resolve this issue?


228 posts

Master Geek


  # 1771287 27-Apr-2017 14:22
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richms:

 

Get on 5GHz if you can, if your devices are not junk and support the DFS channels, use those since they are largely clear still.

 

 

Be careful with DFS channels as:

 

  • Not all consumer devices support DFS channels so they will not see a radio on a DFS channel.
  • DFS channels are required to instigate channel moves if radar is detected and down by the waterfront (if you are down that part of town) you may have issues with radar on the vessels.  Some wireless clients will ignore or not understand the channel move request and disconnect when the radio changes channels.

If you can use DFS channels then do so but always test the wireless clients first.


228 posts

Master Geek


  # 1771321 27-Apr-2017 14:51
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Another consideration is that while using applications like InSSIDer Home and WiFi Analyzer is useful they only tell you the signal amplitude ("strength") not the duty cycles ("duration").  The duty cycles are extremely important in fault finding issues like this but require a spectrum analyzer to determine. 

 


1903 posts

Uber Geek


  # 1771331 27-Apr-2017 15:20
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Localised (overhead) ceiling mounted AP's. I'd also be ensuring that it's not a network issue.



1904 posts

Uber Geek


  # 1771342 27-Apr-2017 15:35
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Crowdie:

 

What is your customer's expectation of the wireless network?

 

 

Unfortunately, the expectation is allways that wifi will work . smile
Its mainly for the staffs phones (personal use) , and for occasional guest use when "guests" need wifi access

 

Ive a spare TPLink AC1200 I can setup there & see how that goes , those with older 2.4 only devices may just have to struggle on
with whats there allready .

 

The issue is seemingly only in the open office area.
The AP that had issues in the open plan area works just fine in the enclosed offices.
PC's on the same network via cable: no issues.

 

 


228 posts

Master Geek


  # 1771383 27-Apr-2017 15:55
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Most cellular phones are single spatial stream and support up to 40 MHz wide channels.   Basically they are not that fast.

 

I would create a guest SSID on 5 GHz only with either a 20 or 40 MHz wide channel.  Try 40 MHz wide first and see how the coverage is.  If coverage is an issue then reduce the channel width to 20 MHz as this will increase the signal strength by 3 dB (double it).

 

I suspect you are under tight cost constraints with this customer?


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