Ditch powerline or get new ones

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alisam

689 posts

Ultimate Geek

#225471 20-Nov-2017 21:03

My primary question is: Should I do away with Powerline boxes and go with (say) a Ubiquiti UniFi product or something else. But is within the average geeks capabilities ( I can read a manual and google for Africa). The reason being, I am constantly having to sort out network outages and stuttering on playback.

My Draytek Vigor 130 Modem is in the garage (House is 2 level, 266 sq metres) and in bridge mode to a Edgerouter Lite 3.

I am on Spark VDSL. Fibre is July 2018 to June 2016 according to Chorus.

I believe I have 2 phase electricity (2 Meters outside). I am using Cat 5e and Cat 6 Patch cables.

The ethernet cable from the ERL3 goes to a Powerline D-Link DHP-601QV (single port, gigabit).

Throughout the house I have 5 others:

2 TP-Line TL-PA411

1 x D-Link DHP-P601QV (single port, gigabit into a 5 port hub)

2 x D-Link DHP-540 4 Port (gigabit)

Speedtest.net on an average day says: Ping: 18 - 22, Download: 36 - 40 Mbps, Upload: 8-10 Mbps

However, and more frequently, the Ping is OK and the Upload is say 7+, but the Download drops to 1 Mbps on a D-Link DHP-540 4 Port which is crucial to streaming from the Study to the rest of the house.

Thereafter, I am switching powerline boxes on and off (30 seconds to an hour) , swapping them out, re-booting PC's etc. Anything to get the speed back.

When I first got my TiVo about 9 years ago I swore I would replace wireless. Then again I had the bog standard ISP Modem Router.

I use an HG659 as a wireless AP, basically to serve my wireless Fitbit bathroom scales and mobile phone and a Spark HG630B AP to serve a mobile phone (since I had them spare).

Finally, I have found the TP-Link Powerline boxes to easily connect to the D-Link ones, rather than D-Link to D-Link.

PC: HP ProBook 470G1 (Windows 10 Pro), Intel NUC7I5BNH (Windows 10 Pro), Dell Inspiron 7591 2n1 (Windows 11 Pro)
Net: Grandstream GWN7062, 3 x Grandstream GWN7610
Storage: Synology DS216play NAS, 2 x 6TB
Media: HDHomeRun Connect, 5 x Amazon FireTV. Echo, Dot, Spot
TV: 2 x Samsung H6400 55" LED TV, Panasonic TH-P50G10Z 50" Plasma TV
Mobile: Samsung Galaxy A52 5G
Wearable: Gear S3 Frontier

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580 posts

Ultimate Geek

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#1904903 20-Nov-2017 22:15

Ditch powerline--I for one have always found these bloody difficult and frequently in need of rebooting.

Replace with a mesh wifi system like netgear Orbi, which will remain an excellent choice when you get fibre. Simplest is best.

gml

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Aredwood

3885 posts

Uber Geek

#1904911 20-Nov-2017 22:32

Does the house have a crawl space underneath, or is it slab on ground? Do you only use the phone lines for VDSL, or are they also used for voice? As sometimes you can re configure phone wiring for use as Ethernet.

Even if you only manage to get 1 Ethernet link from the garage to elsewhere in the house, It might be enough that decent Wifi APs in the garage and on the other end of the Ethernet link might be enough. Especially if you can get your streaming source device onto Ethernet.

alisam

689 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1904956 21-Nov-2017 07:17

Aredwood:

Does the house have a crawl space underneath, or is it slab on ground? Do you only use the phone lines for VDSL, or are they also used for voice? As sometimes you can re configure phone wiring for use as Ethernet.

Even if you only manage to get 1 Ethernet link from the garage to elsewhere in the house, It might be enough that decent Wifi APs in the garage and on the other end of the Ethernet link might be enough. Especially if you can get your streaming source device onto Ethernet.

It's a concrete slab.

We have a landline (unfortunately, my better half will not use her mobile phone).

Also drilling holes into a ceiling is a no go.

Linuxluver

5824 posts

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#1904970 21-Nov-2017 08:16

alisam:

....

I use an HG659 as a wireless AP, basically to serve my wireless Fitbit bathroom scales and mobile phone and a Spark HG630B AP to serve a mobile phone (since I had them spare).

Finally, I have found the TP-Link Powerline boxes to easily connect to the D-Link ones, rather than D-Link to D-Link.

I used powerline networking for about a week. It was too slow (70mbps?) compared to my wifi (466mbps minimum?)

I recently went back to the Spark HG659b modem / router on my fibre connection and added a Google Wifi meshed network. They are really easy to set up and the wifi coverage in the house is better than ever. My desktop system in the lounge now has 866mbps wifi access and when I copy files from my NAS I'm seeing 70-80megaBYTES / second over the wifi. That's almost gigabit ethernet speed.....and I'm really happy with it.

The Google Wifi was $599 (less $150 because work gave me a $150 Westfield gift voucher last Xmas and it was due to expire in 3 weeks).

Meshed wifi looks like the way to go unless you want the better security of a wired network. That's about the only reason left.

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JimmyH

2820 posts

Uber Geek

#1904991 21-Nov-2017 09:09

I have been using similar kit (AV500 Netgear 4-port powerline hubs) since around 2011/12 (from memory).

It's not as good as cabled ethernet obviously. But I have found it rock-solid and reliable. Sustained transfer rates of 80-90 mbps, which is plenty for my main use case of streaming video from a Plex server to PCs. It's just nice to have network ports where I need them without having to open up walls to run cables. And my video streaming experience with WiFi was materially worse.

old3eyes

8995 posts

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#1904994 21-Nov-2017 09:15

I use a pair of D-Link AV500 powerline units between my office and HT gear when I moved into this house in January . Had heaps of problems with the first batch , things like Ethernet just dieing and everything needed rebooting. Did and RMA on them to PBTech and got a new set. Rock solid . Have never had to reboot them and I get about 50Mbits transferring across them..

Regards,

Old3eyes

BTR

1522 posts

Uber Geek

#1904998 21-Nov-2017 09:19

While they are ugly and difficult to make them look tidy can you not just use long ethernet cables? Otherwise a MESH based wireless network is your only real solution,

alisam

689 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1905000 21-Nov-2017 09:29

BTR:

While they are ugly and difficult to make them look tidy can you not just use long ethernet cables? Otherwise a MESH based wireless network is your only real solution,

Absolutely not.

As mentioned, drilling holes seems to be out. So having an ethernet cable snaking up the steps is not something I am going to suggest to the wife.

I'll start to look at MESH systems.

nitro

522 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1905172 21-Nov-2017 12:03

alisam:

Absolutely not.

As mentioned, drilling holes seems to be out. So having an ethernet cable snaking up the steps is not something I am going to suggest to the wife.

I'll start to look at MESH systems.

how about doing it once with wall plates (RJ-45 jackpoint) and cables behind walls? cost might be an issue, if you're getting a pro to do it... but it's a do once thing - rather than upgrading powerline solutions, which would be unlikely to measure up to a fibre connection when you get it.

Goosey

2341 posts

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#1905173 21-Nov-2017 12:07

Why is the modem in the garage? Is this where the lead in from the street comes?

alisam

689 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1905202 21-Nov-2017 12:17

Goosey:

Why is the modem in the garage? Is this where the lead in from the street comes?

Yes

michaelmurfy

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#1905514 21-Nov-2017 22:34

Could you do a ceiling run (as in within the ceiling)? Also, where are you based?

Ceiling mounted access points are incredibly tidy and would be the ideal solution in your case if you own the house. If you're renting then I would recommend either the Ubiquiti Amplifi or the Netgear Orbi however if you're doing this it'll be best to retire the Edgerouter Lite too.

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Starscream122

568 posts

Ultimate Geek
Inactive user

#1905520 21-Nov-2017 22:43

@michaelmurfy could you recommend a ceiling mount access point?

Also do they just connect to a free Lan port on swich/router and bobs your uncle?

I guess then the trouble is getting power to it if it's mounted on the ceiling....

michaelmurfy

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#1905523 21-Nov-2017 22:57

@Starscream122 Most access points are powered over Ethernet so you just need a single ethernet cable to the point you're putting the access point - it is powered by an injector further down the line (where your switch / router is). For a decent ceiling mounted access point with best bang for the buck I would honestly go for the Grandstream GWN7610 (Here). Just ensure you grab a PoE injector like this one to go with it. I have been very impressed with the Grandstream kit for its price.

Basically with these ones you access them via HTTPS (your web browser), if you have multiple access points on the network they'll talk to one another so you need to only configure one and tell it about the other ones and done. One will cover a moderate sized house totally fine but any bigger than this you may as well get two for the best 5GHz coverage.

alisam

689 posts

Ultimate Geek

#1905567 22-Nov-2017 07:19

michaelmurfy:

@Starscream122 Most access points are powered over Ethernet so you just need a single ethernet cable to the point you're putting the access point - it is powered by an injector further down the line (where your switch / router is). For a decent ceiling mounted access point with best bang for the buck I would honestly go for the Grandstream GWN7610 (Here). Just ensure you grab a PoE injector like this one to go with it. I have been very impressed with the Grandstream kit for its price.

Basically with these ones you access them via HTTPS (your web browser), if you have multiple access points on the network they'll talk to one another so you need to only configure one and tell it about the other ones and done. One will cover a moderate sized house totally fine but any bigger than this you may as well get two for the best 5GHz coverage.

I like the Orbi and even Google Wifi, however, I cannot see the point of getting rid of the ERL3.

So, I could run a cable (in the garage) to a wooden beam (on the house side) and mount the Grandstream vertically, pointing into the house so as (hopefully) to cover the ground floor and the upstairs. I reckon the house is 266 sq metres (2863 sq feet).

I personally won't be attempting to install a second unit and the chances of getting someone in, is non-existent.

Would the Grandstream cover the whole house?

Also, I realise that I will still need a powerline box for an HDHomeRun Connect because it is not wireless and has to connect to the terrestial aerial.

Also, I have a Synology NAS which could be wireless with a dongle (but I probably wouldn't). The alternative is to also put the NAS in the garage and use a network switch. Therefore, I would only need 2 powerline boxes, which would cover both devices.

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