Trouble with switch between ONT and modem

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Futurianzero

10 posts

Wannabe Geek

#280011 22-Nov-2020 12:48

I'm sure I've blinded myself to some very obvious solution that someone on here can help me with...

I've got fibre installed at my place, with the ONT in a Hills Home Hub in the downstairs garage. I have a Netgear ProSafe GS108 8-port switch in the hub, with patch leads to the built-in CAT6a wiring. There is a Spark Smart Modem upstairs, in a room with 2 in-wall ethernet sockets, but up 4 things that want ethernet (TV, PS4, Raspberry Pi, Steam Link). The Smart Modem only has 4 ports, one of which must be for internet connection. So there are 3 free on the modem and one in the wall.

The ONT currently connects to the Smart Modem via the switch and patch panel. This works fine, the ONT and Smart Modem find each other and the internet gets through.

I recently ran an ethernet line to my office, one end in a PC and the other end in the switch. The PC only ever gets a self-assigned IP address though, and doesn't get internet. It looks like the LAN1 port (which is used for fibre connection) on the Smart Modem doesn't assign IPs downstream to the switch. Internet doesn't seem to connect via LAN2-LAN4.

I did get better results when patching the Smart Modem back through the 2nd wall socket and back to the switch, which gives the PC an IP address and internet. This seems to confirm that the LAN1 port doesn't route downstream. But doing this takes out one of the available ethernet ports in the modem and one in the wall, leaving only 2 to connect to devices.

The wifi service on the Smart Modem is best if it is located upstairs, so I don't want to leave it in the hub.

I have an old HG659b available, which I have tried to insert between the ONT and the switch to get routing going down there. When bridged, the internet did get through to the Smart Modem, but not to the PC. It didn't work in bridged mode, non-bridged with DHCP server on, or non-bridged with DHCP server off. I may have tried other combinations that I don't remember. I suppose I could put the HG659b upstairs and connect all the entertainment gear to it, but I'm running out of power sockets in that room...

What am I doing wrong? I don't have any budget for new gear, and would really prefer to keep things tidy using existing equipment.

snnet

1410 posts

Uber Geek

#2608365 22-Nov-2020 12:59

ONT GE1 / port 1 needs to go to one of the ports you have where the spark smart modem sits into it's fibre port, then one lan cable from a smart modem lan port into the second jack, down to the hub patch panel to feed the netgear switch. Then patch other items into the switch in the hub. If you need more ports at the modem position you'll need to buy a cheap $50 switch from the likes of pb tech.

lxsw20

3552 posts

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#2608366 22-Nov-2020 13:01

Who is your ISP?

A diagram of your setup might be handy.

It sounds like you're trying to plug a PC on a switch thats between the ONT and the WAN? This will not work, and isn't designed to. Nor should you plug a LAN side port in to the same switch as your WAN side, even if it does seem to work.

Why are you running the ONT<>Router connection (wan connection) via a switch? Can you not just route them through directly.

Jase2985

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#2608368 22-Nov-2020 13:17

ONT > Hills Patch Panel > upstairs > WAN Port Spark Smart Router will give you internet via the Spark Router.

LAN port Spark Smart Router > Hills Patch Panel > Switch > Hills Patch Panel to other network ports in the house

You will need another switch upstairs for the extras couple of devices you have there.

Can get a 5 port dlink switch for about $30 from PBTECH or the likes

cyril7

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#2608427 22-Nov-2020 14:22

Hi, as others have said, key thing is you must use both Ethernet ports where the smart modem is in the lounge, one Ethernet connection takes the ONT port directly (not via any switch) to the WAN port of the modem, then return one of the LAN ports on the smart modem via the 2nd ethernet port back to the hub, this connects to the switch, now distribute the lan via the switch to other rooms, use a 5 or 8 port switch (as Jason has linked above) to expand LAN ports where needed.

Cyril

Futurianzero

10 posts

Wannabe Geek

#2608605 22-Nov-2020 18:19

Thanks geeks. Looks like I presumed too much of that LAN1 port and will have to add a switch upstairs.
Maybe that explains why that room has the two ports in the first place.

At least it will allow for attaching some more entertainment devices in that room in the future.

Spyware

3761 posts

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#2608606 22-Nov-2020 18:26

https://www.dummies.com/programming/networking/network-basics-routers/

Spark Max Fibre using Mikrotik CCR1009-8G-1S-1S+, CRS125-24G-1S, Unifi UAP, U6-Pro, UAP-AC-M-Pro, Apple TV 4K (2022), Apple TV 4K (2017), iPad Air 1st gen, iPad Air 4th gen, iPhone 13, SkyNZ3151 (the white box). If it doesn't move then it's data cabled.

richms

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#2608646 22-Nov-2020 20:06

It will work with a switch like with both the WAN and LAN on the router plugged back into it if the ISP uses VLAN 10 for the PPP or DHCP connection. Hardly ideal but if it is what it takes to get it working with how things are then may as well.

Only thing is that it potentially exposes your whole LAN to the ONT, and you are relying on it never doing anything with its untagged interface, which who knows what may happen. Also it relies on it being a semi-dumb switch that is able to pass the whole ethernet frames around even tho there is a vlan tag on it, and not block them etc like some are set up to do.

You really want the ONT directly connected to the router as others have mentioned, but I can confirm that a single cable and 2 switches will work between the ont and router if everything lines up properly. Will kill speeds tho since that is a singe gigabit link that things are passing thru both ways.

Richard rich.ms

Equinox IT

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cyril7

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#2608790 23-Nov-2020 09:11

richms:

It will work with a switch like with both the WAN and LAN on the router plugged back into it if the ISP uses VLAN 10 for the PPP or DHCP connection. Hardly ideal but if it is what it takes to get it working with how things are then may as well.

Only thing is that it potentially exposes your whole LAN to the ONT, and you are relying on it never doing anything with its untagged interface, which who knows what may happen. Also it relies on it being a semi-dumb switch that is able to pass the whole ethernet frames around even tho there is a vlan tag on it, and not block them etc like some are set up to do.

You really want the ONT directly connected to the router as others have mentioned, but I can confirm that a single cable and 2 switches will work between the ont and router if everything lines up properly. Will kill speeds tho since that is a singe gigabit link that things are passing thru both ways.

Which is a really good question for @BMarquis, one would assume and hope that the ONT will just drop all untagged broadcast traffic heading toward the ONT, and accordingly not source any, regardless its not ideal, better to isolate it in some manner.

Cyril

BMarquis

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Chorus

Lifetime subscriber

#2608796 23-Nov-2020 09:20

Unfortunately it is Service/RSP/ONT hardware dependent, so the answer isn't straight forward.
However, in this case I think it is true that the untagged traffic won't be tagged and forwarded. You should be safe.

As everyone has said, it's not ideal though... It is also prone to the service/RSP/ONT behavior changing in the future without you necessarily knowing.

If the Router is not in the same location as the ONT and switch, it can consume extra ethernet ports.

I've only skim read the thread, so I believe it has been mentioned, the ideal setup is - ONT-> RGW->switch->Devices.
When the ONT and switch are co-located, but the RGW is remote, its ONT->patch->RGW -> patch -> switch -> patch ->devices

and if you are running out of ethernet cables/ports and some devices are near the RGW, you can use the RGW ports as well.

ONT->patch->RGW -> patch -> switch -> patch ->devices
|-> devices

Futurianzero

10 posts

Wannabe Geek

#2608816 23-Nov-2020 09:39

This touches on what I was trying to achieve with the HG659b in the hub cabinet, except that I had convinced myself that it should be a bridge instead of a gateway.

It would be acceptable to have the HG659b connected to the ONT (which is a model 300) and negotiating the internet connection, as well as handling routing through the switch and patch panel, with the Smart Modem upstairs essentially only doing WiFi and a few LAN connections. ONT > HG659b (as gateway) > switch > patch > smart modem (as access point) and devices. I will give it a try next time everyone in the house is off the internet. Otherwise sticking to ONT > patch > Smart Modem > patch > switch, and Smart Modem > [new switch] > devices

I bet when I get this all set up properly, Spark immediately offers the new Chorus ONT RGW service and negates the need for a separate gateway downstairs... and it would have enough LAN ports to remove the need for a switch downstairs too. At least until I find a use for the RJ45 outlet in the pantry...