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PntBlnk

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#64247 12-Jul-2010 00:08

The following is a copy of feedback posted through Orcon's web site. I publish it here in the hope that a publicly aired complaint will be a more effective instrument to persuade Orcon to address the poor service levels provided to its ADSL customers. If you are also an Orcon customer, and have experiences similar to what I describe below, please add them and any other comments you might have for Orcon to this thread. 

My feedback:
Since my wife and I joined Orcon on May 27 of this year, we seem to have been affected by the following problem with Orcon's quality of service:

"28/05/10 9:04 PM DEGRADED BROADBAND PERFORMANCE DURING PEAK HOURS ON STANDARD ORCON BROADBAND PLANS
Over the past week we have become aware of a congestion issue with one of our handover links on our broadband network. These links pass the broadband traffic between our suppliers network and our own. The result of this is that approximately quarter of our customers may be experiencing lower than usual broadband performance during peak times.
This has particularly become an issue this week as our customers had their data allowance reset after billing on the 23rd of May, which means that they begin using a lot of data again.

We are aware of how frustrating this can be, and want to assure you that we are taking this issue very seriously. We have been working really hard to come up with a solution, and have implemented a couple of temporary measures to improve performance. However we are still working on a long term solution. As soon as we have this solution we will be implementing it without delay. Please accept our apologies for this issue. We will update you as soon as we have a solution and a confirmed date for implementation."

When we paid our first Orcon bill of $155.39+GST earlier this month, we had the distinct feeling that we were being ripped off. I am frustrated, and I'd like to see some evidence that Orcon is taking the issue as seriously as it says.

During "peak hours", which I can only presume means "the time when people want to use their home broadband connections", the software updates for my Linux systems can arrive at the staggeringly low rate of 12-24kB/s. When I remotely perform the same updates from work (not during "peak hours") the download rate is in the order of 700kB/s or faster, from the same update sites (during their peak times), with the same computer, ADSL router, ADSL splitter, and telephone line. Extremely poor network latency and throughput during during the evening, and adequate latency and throughput during the day, has been our consistent experience since the start of our Orcon "experience".

When I telephoned Orcon Support to ask when the above issue, as it appears on the Network Status Updates page of the Orcon web site, would likely be resolved, the well-meaning, but thoroughly misguided person on the telephone asked that I check my modem settings, and perform a series of basic network connectivity tests in order to determine if there was some problem with my equipment. Not seeing any harm in this I obliged, though I was confused as to why I was checking my equipment when it seemed patently obvious that the atrocious network performance was almost certainly the result of the DEGRADED BROADBAND PERFORMANCE DURING PEAK HOURS ON STANDARD ORCON BROADBAND PLANS issue on Orcon's web site. Testing your Internet connection is a fairly sensible thing to do once in a while, even when you think everything is working correctly, so an hour of my time was spent conducting the requested tests and sending the results through to Orcon Support.

At that point, I was told that yes, the latency and throughput of my connection was very poor, and a fault ticket would then be logged. I thought this kind of odd, as I was under the impression that it was standard practice for IT support desks to log a ticket the first time someone calls up about a fault, but I digress.

I was then asked to download and run the "Orcon Diagnostics" program for Microsoft Windows (I don't use Windows), or the version for Apple Mac OS X (I don't use OS X). When running the Windows version of this software with a compatibility layer on my Linux system, I could see that this program is nothing more than a wrapper that uses the operating system's own basic network diagnosis utilities, such as ping and tracert, to run through precisely the same kinds of tests I had just spent an hour conducting manually. Why are customers not simply asked to use this automated time-saving utility in the first place (irrespective of whether a Linux version exists)?

This is where it became apparent to me that it must be Orcon's deliberate policy to keep its customers busy and delay for as long as possible without actually addressing the real issues with Orcon's quality of service. So I decided at that point, quite justifiably I think, to cease wasting my limited time with Orcon Support.

However, having recently paid over $155.39+GST, money for which I worked extremely hard, to a company that by all appearances doesn't, I feel once again compelled to ask, just when will Orcon provide its customers with the service they pay for? When, precisely, does Orcon plan to update customers on the unresolved serious problems with its broadband service announced FORTY FIVE DAYS AGO? What recompense will Orcon offer customers who are in effect paying for "broadband" internet at dial-up speeds?

Will Orcon immediately suspend all television, print, and web advertising aimed at growing its customer base? It seems to me that Orcon's available network bandwidth is grossly oversubscribed, and more customers will only exacerbate the situation for everyone. Perhaps the money saved could be redirected into whatever is required to bring Orcon's service levels up to those for which its existing customers pay for each month, who knows?

I have posted a copy of this feedback to the Orcon, iServe and Kordia forum on GeekZone (http://www.geekzone.co.nz/forums.asp?forumid=82). Perhaps a response to all customers affected by Orcon's poor service is warranted more than one to me alone. 

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sbiddle
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  #350069 12-Jul-2010 06:46
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I assume you have performed basic tests such as an isolation test that remove your internal phone wiring from the equation? What sort of line sync stats do you get (this data can be viewed in your modem).

The reality is that by far the vast majority of people's ADSL problems are caused by internal house wiring rather than any issues with ISP's.




PenultimateHop
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  #350074 12-Jul-2010 08:10
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PntBlnk: This has particularly become an issue this week as our customers had their data allowance reset after billing on the 23rd of May, which means that they begin using a lot of data again."

Amazing they haven't moved away from this practice which causes congestion at the same point in the month, every month.  Shifting to a daily billing cycle based on the customer's anniversary is an extremely easy way to smooth out the breaks-and-troughs in bandwidth utilisation for ISPs utilising caps.

PntBlnk

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  #350107 12-Jul-2010 09:51

It would be remiss of me if I hadn't! I am an experienced IT professional familiar with fault diagnostics and networking. Isolation tests are also requested as a part of the Orcon Support procedure, and I carried them out as requested.

Note also that the poor network throughput and latency is only evident during "peak times", and adequate during business hours on weekdays. I am hard-pushed to think of a localised fault in a domestic network that would produce such a consistent pattern.



sbiddle
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  #350111 12-Jul-2010 10:00
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PntBlnk: It would be remiss of me if I hadn't! I am an experienced IT professional familiar with fault diagnostics and networking. Isolation tests are also requested as a part of the Orcon Support procedure, and I carried them out as requested.

Note also that the poor network throughput and latency is only evident during "peak times", and adequate during business hours on weekdays. I am hard-pushed to think of a localised fault in a domestic network that would produce such a consistent pattern.


What are your sync speeds?


raab
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  #350112 12-Jul-2010 10:03
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I very much doubt it's isolated to the OP.

There's already a 3 page thread on gpforums with regards to slow intl performance back in May. I'm assuming it still isn't addressed, which doesn't surprise me.

http://www.gpforums.co.nz/thread/391027/?s=

You're better off switching ISP's than having to wait for Orcon to do anything.

PntBlnk

23 posts

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  #350122 12-Jul-2010 10:16

Here's the results to the tests requested by Orcon Support. If you'd like more information feel free to ask, but I'd like a plausible scenario out of you first describing a localised fault with a domestic ADSL connection or network would replicate a peak-time network congestion pattern. I think that's only fair.

I'd also like to say that I would like to avoid this thread becoming a technical nitpicking session, which is why I omitted the technical specifics in the first place.
 


Thank you for your call regarding the slow speeds you have been experiencing on your Orcon Broadband Internet Connection.

So we may further investigate and resolve this for you; please supply me with the following supplementary information:-

Modem:
► What type of modem are you using? (Brand and Model)



Netgear DG834V3 



Modem Interface Statistics (See below for instructions)
► Line Rate (Downstream and Upstream)



 14725 kbps down, 1027 kbps up



► Line Attenuation (Downstream and Upstream)



20 db down, 4.5 db up 



► Noise Margin (Downstream and Upstream)



10 db down, 11 db up 



Using the ‘speedtest.net’ website, what are the results to these locations?
► NZ (Wellington)



90 ms ping, 1.07 Mb/s down, 0.83 Mb/s up


► AU (Sydney)


 235 ms ping, 1.17 Mb/s down, 0.69 Mb/s up


► UK (London)


 366 ms ping, 0.54 Mb/s down, 0.17 Mb/s up


► CA (San Francisco)


 264ms ping, 0.39 Mb/s down 0.40 Mb/s up

 

If you could also note the speeds you used to get as a reference, old speed tests would be ideal but if you don’t have these then just stating what speeds you used to get is fine.

A trace route and ping to each of the following servers (See below for Instructions):
► nzdsl.co.nz



 HOST: athlux                             Loss%   Snt   Last   Avg  Best  Wrst StDev
  1. www.routerlogin.com                 0.0%    50    0.4   0.5   0.4   1.1   0.2
  2. lo1-ubs.erx2.nct.orcon.net.nz       0.0%    50   19.1  32.5  18.6  79.1  16.3
  3. ge-2-0-3-201.cre2.nct.orcon.net.nz  2.0%    50   36.3  32.7  16.9  85.5  18.4
  4. 121.98.9.146                        0.0%    50   32.3  43.3  22.2  89.2  17.9
  5. 121.98.9.142                        2.0%    50   39.5  46.0  22.8 106.4  20.6
  6. 121.98.9.141                        0.0%    50   26.0  32.5  17.7  82.7  18.7
  7. 60.234.76.50                        0.0%    50   19.8  32.2  18.0  88.6  18.1


► trademe.co.nz


 HOST: athlux                             Loss%   Snt   Last   Avg  Best  Wrst StDev
  1. www.routerlogin.com                 0.0%    50    0.4   0.6   0.4   1.9   0.4
  2. lo1-ubs.erx2.nct.orcon.net.nz       0.0%    50  100.6  87.4  43.0 117.4  17.1
  3. ge-2-0-3-201.cre2.nct.orcon.net.nz  0.0%    50   70.6  87.8  46.4 168.0  23.3
  4. ge-0-0-0-222.cre2.wgt.orcon.net.nz  4.0%    50   80.5 106.4  71.6 151.6  16.8
  5. trademe.wix.net.nz                  0.0%    50   73.2  96.9  58.5 126.8  16.1
  6. www.trademe.co.nz                   0.0%    50   59.7  96.0  59.7 127.4  15.4



► google.com


 HOST: athlux                             Loss%   Snt   Last   Avg  Best  Wrst StDev
  1. www.routerlogin.com                 0.0%    50    0.5   0.7   0.4   2.9   0.4
  2. lo1-ubs.erx2.nct.orcon.net.nz       0.0%    50   98.3  75.3  23.5 106.8  22.6
  3. ge-2-0-3-201.cre2.nct.orcon.net.nz  0.0%    50   90.5  75.1  23.9 112.7  21.6
  4. 121.98.9.146                        2.0%    50  105.1  84.9  25.1 137.6  27.1
  5. ge-0-1-0-598.cre1.eqx.orcon.net.nz  2.0%    50  128.1 108.5  50.3 151.3  25.9
  6. GOOGLE-GW.cre1.eqx.orcon.net.nz     2.0%    50  134.7 100.9  44.9 135.4  24.1
  7. 66.249.95.232                       0.0%    50  148.3 108.4  50.7 148.3  25.5
  8. 64.233.174.242                      0.0%    50  134.6 106.1  47.9 145.5  23.9
  9. syd01s01-in-f104.1e100.net          4.0%    50  102.1 109.9  56.8 141.5  24.0



► theregister.co.uk


 HOST: athlux                               Loss%   Snt   Last   Avg  Best  Wrst StDev
  1. www.routerlogin.com                   0.0%    50    0.8   0.6   0.4   4.6   0.6
  2. lo1-ubs.erx2.nct.orcon.net.nz         0.0%    50   60.7  77.4  37.1 110.0  18.8
  3. ge-2-0-3-201.cre2.nct.orcon.net.nz    0.0%    50   50.6  75.0  32.2 106.6  19.6
  4. 121.98.9.146                          2.0%    50   54.6  85.3  43.0 124.4  20.3
  5. ORC-0014.GW1.AKL1.asianetcom.net      0.0%    50   72.6  87.6  47.0 127.6  21.2
  6. Gi10-0-0-401.GW1.AKL1.asianetcom.net  0.0%    50   62.2  75.5  33.2 113.9  19.7
  7. po10-0.gw5.lax1.asianetcom.net        0.0%    50  203.8 204.5 150.2 237.5  20.4
  8. gi12-0-0.gw3.lax1.asianetcom.net      0.0%    50  205.6 204.9 149.8 238.8  20.4
  9. ge-11-1-5.mpr1.lax12.us.above.net     2.0%    50  209.4 214.4 165.0 336.2  27.1
 10. xe-1-2-0.er2.lax9.us.above.net        2.0%    50  221.2 221.0 158.1 309.6  26.5
 11. ge-2-1-0.mpr4.lax9.us.above.net       0.0%    50  216.1 215.1 160.4 276.5  23.4
 12. so-0-3-0.mpr4.iah1.us.above.net       6.0%    50  240.5 237.4 181.1 280.9  22.8
 13. so-1-1-0.mpr2.dca2.us.above.net       2.0%    50  270.6 274.3 229.8 312.6  20.7
 14. so-0-1-0.mpr1.lhr3.uk.above.net       0.0%    50  350.5 347.9 296.0 415.4  22.0
 15. so-0-0-0.mpr1.lhr2.uk.above.net       2.0%    50  327.9 340.3 280.9 393.1  22.8
 16. 213-152-254-148.available.above.net   2.0%    50  326.2 347.7 300.8 528.6  39.2
 17. vl901.core1.lon.rackspace.net         2.0%    50  333.7 347.0 301.5 409.7  19.6
 18. vl911.core6a.lon3.rackspace.net       2.0%    50  479.8 352.5 294.9 525.3  49.3
 19. aggr321a-2-core6a.lon3.rackspace.net  4.0%    50  344.5 342.5 297.6 387.1  21.6
 20. 212.100.234.54                        2.0%    50  326.1 339.8 301.6 377.5  19.5





Other things to check:
► Do you use filters on your phone lines or do you have dedicated jack point for your ADSL connection?



We use a filter on our single active phone jack.

 

► When did this start to occur? (Think back, something may have changed which made this happen)



Ever since we joined, though it is worse than usual today.

 

► Check the Cabling. (Are all telephone sockets in use filtered?)



Tried with and without the filter.

 

► Try a different modem if possible. (This is often the cause)



I have a single port NetComm DB6 here on standby, and will try it if you consider it necessary (I haven't even un-boxed it). My current modem is also a 4-port switch.



► Isolate the modem. (Unplug all devices/filters from the jackpoints in the home and connect the modem directly to the telephone line)



Done. No improvement.

 

► Do you have a Monitored Alarm or Sky Digital/HDi?



No.



raab
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  #350272 12-Jul-2010 14:34
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Wonder if its bandwidth issues with asianet, wouldn't surprise me

 
 
 

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Athlonite
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  #351991 15-Jul-2010 17:00
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yeah I've pings go from 50~60ms into asianet then go up to 2~3 hundred ms going through and out of asianet I am at a loss as to why Orcon continue to use them

C:\Windows\SysWOW64>tracert www.google.com

Tracing route to www.l.google.com [66.102.7.104]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 1 ms <1 ms <1 ms 192.168.1.1
2 23 ms 25 ms 22 ms lo1-ubs.erx2.nct.orcon.net.nz [60.234.8.200]
3 21 ms 21 ms 21 ms ge-2-0-3-201.cre2.nct.orcon.net.nz [121.98.9.69]

4 36 ms 21 ms 23 ms 121.98.9.146
5 48 ms 49 ms 52 ms ge-0-1-0-598.cre1.eqx.orcon.net.nz [121.98.104.1
]
6 47 ms 47 ms 76 ms GOOGLE-GW.cre1.eqx.orcon.net.nz [121.98.104.2]
7 53 ms 47 ms 54 ms 66.249.95.234
8 151 ms 155 ms 153 ms 209.85.249.52 into asianet
9 180 ms 162 ms 188 ms 209.85.255.56
10 233 ms 229 ms 238 ms 209.85.242.251 out of asianet
11 206 ms 205 ms 205 ms 72.14.232.84
12 209 ms 215 ms 220 ms 209.85.249.188
13 214 ms 215 ms 209 ms 72.14.239.246
14 218 ms 208 ms 214 ms lax04s01-in-f104.1e100.net [66.102.7.104]

Trace complete.

Sounddude
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  #352042 15-Jul-2010 18:37
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Athlonite: yeah I've pings go from 50~60ms into asianet then go up to 2~3 hundred ms going through and out of asianet I am at a loss as to why Orcon continue to use them


50~60ms is quite usual, since the next hop is over seas. Infact the traceroute you just posted was going over Orcons international link to orcons google direct peer in Sydney.

The IP's you have pointed out as Asianet, are actually google routers and have nothing to do with Asianetcom.

The speed of light can only go so fast.

 


gjm

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  #352052 15-Jul-2010 18:59
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<Begin Rant>
I have finally had enough of Orcon. I have performed tests adnauseum, put up with a connection that goes up and down like a yoyo, logged calls that dissappear and called back to find no reference of my previous problem, had speeds that snail mail could beat and been destroyed in any online shooter Ive tried to play because of the atrocious lag, esp at peak times. Ive tried different modems, filters, with a phone plugged in, without a phone plugged in, checked my house wiring, put the cat outside, consulted my star sign and it still doesnt work, guess what....ITS NOT A PROBLEM AT MY END!!!

Orcon your service has become lousy and Im no longer willing to put up with it while you try and find (take guesses) at a solution. Im leaving and as an IT professional will be advising anyone who asks me, to steer well away from you (and yes lots of people ask me).

Ive given you plenty of chances to fix the problems and you have held your middle finger up to me while laughing and taking my money.

No more, my 30 days notice is on its way. Anyway recommend a good provider? I hear Snap is ok?

<End Rant>

 




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cafeg
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  #352082 15-Jul-2010 20:28
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xtra has great speeds and no congestion..

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