Question: about differences between DVB-T & HD-DVD playback

Forums › Freeview (DVB-T/DVB-S) › Question: about differences between DVB-T & HD-DVD playback

1gkar

722 posts

Ultimate Geek

#20445 26-Mar-2008 20:53

Hi,

I'm about to upgrade my AMD 3000+ based HTPC for freeview viewing.

What are any different requirements for high definition playback of broadcast DVB-T as opposed to Blu-Ray or HD-DVD playback?

As I understand it, you only need HDCP compliance if you are viewing a 1080P signal from its source. But will my PC hardware, as shown below, play the HD signal? Or is an upgrade required to ensure stable playback of the broadcast stream?

AMD643000+ CPU (not O/Ced)
    Zalman 7000B-ALCu CPU cooler
    MSI K8N NEO4-F mobo 22/6/06 1D BIOS
    MSINX6600LE video card
    2X Hauppauge 150MCE tuner cards
    Winfast TV2000XP Deluxe tuner card (no drivers installed)
    1GB DDR400 Ram
    1X SATA 500GB HDD-3X partitions incl. 16GB boot
    1X SATA 110 HDD -single partition for TV records
    1X SATA 160GB HDD -2X partitions
    Silverstone SST-ST400 PSU (new)
    Benq DW1640 DVD-RW
    Asus E616 DVD Rom
    Silverstone LC14 HTPC case
    MCE Remote
    BTC 9019URF Cordless Keyboard/Joystick-Mouse Combo
Software:

    MCE2005 with all updates
    Nvidia Purevideo codecs
    Zoomplayer 5.** final for non-MCE media playback
    Winamp 5.52 for non-MCE music playback

Obviously, I will be upgrading from my analogue cards to a digital one. I'm looking at this one, http://digitalnow.com.au/dvbtcards.html assuming New Zealand Freeview Standards are the same as Australian ones. Anyone know?? Thanks.

Silverstone LC14 HTPC Case/Intel E4600 CPU/GA-EP35-DS3 MOBO/Asus EN9500GT graphics/2GB RAM/total 2TB HDD space/HVR-2200 & 2X 150MCE tuner cards/LG GGC-H20L BD Drive/MCE2005/Mediaportal/TVServer 1.1.0Final/LG 55"3D LED-TV/Denon AVR-1803 receiver/X1 projector

walt12

324 posts

Ultimate Geek

#118890 26-Mar-2008 21:01

For DTT, the easiest way to trouble-free setup is to get a PCI-E video card which supports hardware acceleration of H.264 decoding. If your motherboard only has AGP then straight away you need an upgrade there, which may lead you to want to upgrade the CPU anyway.

Bottom line, DTT almost demands a whole system upgrade unless using hardware of very recent vintage. Post processing of the captured HD transport streams, should also be a consideration in a HTPC.

1gkar

722 posts

Ultimate Geek

#118898 26-Mar-2008 21:16

I've just answered one of my own questions in posing a query in another thread: Aussie cards aren't compatible. Damn, Damn, Damn, Damn, Damn, Damn, Damn, Damn. I was SO looking forward to a dual digital card requiring only one aerial connection. Any other cards fit the bill that ARE compatible??????

Will Australian digital terrestrial receivers (set top boxes) and iDTV's (integrated digital TV's) work in NZ?

No they won't. Australia use MPEG-2 (compression) for their terrestrial (UHF aerial) broadcast and Freeview NZ will use MPEG-4. Some channels will be broadcast in HD (high definition) only and therefore you will need an HD capable receiver. http://freeviewnz.tv/index.php?section_id=9&category_id=3

Which leads me to your response: why is H.264 decoding a requirement for playback of Freeview's (HD)DVB-T broadcast stream? As it states it will be propogated using MPEG4.

walt12

324 posts

Ultimate Geek

#118904 26-Mar-2008 21:22

H.264 is one of the MPEG4 codecs.

Secondly, STBs sourced from Oz will be no good, but DVB-T cards will be fine. All a DVB-T card does is tune and capture the source. The PVR software and codecs perform the decode, although we have found from testing that it is better if the H.264 decoding is offloaded to the GPU.

1gkar

722 posts

Ultimate Geek

#118913 26-Mar-2008 21:32

walt12: H.264 is one of the MPEG4 codecs.

Thanks. That was also clarified in another thread.

Secondly, STBs sourced from Oz will be no good, but DVB-T cards will be fine. All a DVB-T card does is tune and capture the source. The PVR software and codecs perform the decode, although we have found from testing that it is better if the H.264 decoding is offloaded to the GPU.

Okay. Maybe I'll be safe with the card I was looking at. But what are you specifically saying in that last part about, "although we have found from testing that it is better if the H.264 decoding is offloaded to the GPU." A higher rated video card, like an 8500GT, is better? Cheers.

walt12

324 posts

Ultimate Geek

#118919 26-Mar-2008 21:47

Yes a 8500GT would be good.

What I mean is, the decoding can be done in software, and thus performed by the CPU, but it requires a lot of CPU-time, and if in the case of TV3, the stream is also interlaced (requiring deinterlacing) then you will end up with CPU use at 80-100%, which will result in stuttering while viewing live TV.

So better that you have a video card (GPU) that supports and is verified to do the decoding = hardware decoding.

cranz

675 posts

Ultimate Geek

Trusted

#118934 26-Mar-2008 22:14

You should look at Hauppauge Nova-T-500 (dual DVB-T tuner)
It has 1 coax input (for aerial).

I'm currently using a Nova-T-500 card for freeview and its dual tuner is amazing! only about $120 also

1gkar

722 posts

Ultimate Geek

#119079 27-Mar-2008 16:10

walt12: Yes a 8500GT would be good.

What I mean is, the decoding can be done in software, and thus performed by the CPU, but it requires a lot of CPU-time, and if in the case of TV3, the stream is also interlaced (requiring deinterlacing) then you will end up with CPU use at 80-100%, which will result in stuttering while viewing live TV.

So better that you have a video card (GPU) that supports and is verified to do the decoding = hardware decoding.

Thanks, Walt. It appears my existing card should be compatible (check feature list below). But if not, or undersized, I might upgrade to a card that is certified for HD-DVD (Blu-Ray) playback & be done with it. I think I'll try the tuner card upgrade first & see what eventuates.

Geforce 6600LE Chipset Features

• NVIDIA® CineFX™ 3.0 engine
• 64-bit texture filtering support delivers full-speed, high dynamic-range (HDR) lighting effects
• Unmatched image quality delivered through new 16x anisotropic filtering and rotated grid
antialiasing
• 4x shadow processing power with NVIDIA® UltraShadow™ II for next generation games
• Infinite program length allows for a new class of special effects
• Hardware-accelerated MPEG and WMV9 decode delivers smooth, artifact-free video
• Dedicated video hardware reduces CPU utilization and improves overall system performance
• On-chip video encoder and motion estimation engine provides fast, high-quality encoding
from TV tuner
• Programmable video engine ensures compatibility with future video codecs
• High-quality video scaling and filtering improves playback quality at any window size
• PCI Express support accelerates video editing by speeding up data transfer rates
• Integrated HDTV-output brings content from your desktop to your high-definition TV
• NVIDIA® ForceWare™ software delivers unmatched features and rock-solid stability
• High dynamic-range (HDR) rendering
• NVIDIA® UltraShadow™ II technology
• NVIDIA® Intellisample™ 3.0 technology
• NVIDIA® ForceWare™ Unified Driver Architecture (UDA)
• NVIDIA® nView™ multi-display technology
• NVIDIA® Digital Vibrance Control™ 3.0
• On-chip video processor
• 64-bit floating point texture filtering and blending
• Microsoft® DirectX™ 9.0 Shader Model 3.0 support
• OpenGL® 1.5 support
• Superscalar GPU architecture
• Innovative 0.11 micron process technology
• Operating Systems Support Windows® XP / 2000
• Power supply of 350 (and up) watt is highly recommended for system stability
• Memory Interface: 128-bit
• Core clock: 300MHz
• Memory clock: 500MHz

You should look at Hauppauge Nova-T-500 (dual DVB-T tuner)
It has 1 coax input (for aerial).

I'm currently using a Nova-T-500 card for freeview and its dual tuner is amazing! only about $120 also.

Thanks for the headsup on this card, Cranz. I'll definitely check it out. I'll have to take a look at your guide, also. Cheers.

Equinox IT

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walt12

324 posts

Ultimate Geek

#119080 27-Mar-2008 16:13

No.

That supports MPEG2 hardware acceleration.

This is MPEG4, H.264 hardware decoding, NVidia refers to it as PureVideoHD decoding.

1gkar

722 posts

Ultimate Geek

#119098 27-Mar-2008 17:12

According to this post http://www.geekzone.co.nz/forums.asp?ForumId=34&TopicId=20310 it will decode an H.264 stream but may well struggle. I'll probably do a test once I have upgraded to Freeview, more for curiousity than anything else. If I do need an upgrade, I'll definitley be purchasing an HDCP compliant card. Thanks.

sbiddle

30853 posts

Uber Geek

Retired Mod

Trusted

Biddle Corp

Lifetime subscriber

#119101 27-Mar-2008 17:18

I wouldn't even bother with a Generation 6 or 7 NVidia. 8500GT's work perfectly and you're not going to pay more than $120ish for one.

1gkar

722 posts

Ultimate Geek

#119124 27-Mar-2008 18:23

sbiddle,

Cheers. Is your 8500GT HDCP compliant? If so, what make & model? I'm getting bug-eyed trying to find any store info on whether the models they sell are.

They definitely don't assist with volunteering info like most Aussie & USA stores do. As for the manufacturer sites: they (well, MSI do, at least) state it is an optional item, which puts the onus back to the NZ stores. AAARRRRGGGGG!!

mentalinc

3225 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

#119127 27-Mar-2008 18:54

1gkar: sbiddle,

Cheers. Is your 8500GT HDCP compliant? If so, what make & model? I'm getting bug-eyed trying to find any store info on whether the models they sell are.

They definitely don't assist with volunteering info like most Aussie & USA stores do. As for the manufacturer sites: they (well, MSI do, at least) state it is an optional item, which puts the onus back to the NZ stores. AAARRRRGGGGG!!

The biggest issue is your screen HDCP compliant.
90% of computer LCDS are not HDCP so little point in focussing on that there is plenty of software to get around it , most dont even look at the tag.

CPU: AMD 5900x | RAM: GSKILL Trident Z Neo RGB F4-3600C16D-32GTZNC-32-GB | MB: Asus X570-E | GFX: EVGA FTW3 Ultra RTX 3080Ti| Monitor: LG 27GL850-B 2560x1440

Quic: https://account.quic.nz/refer/473833 R473833EQKIBX

1gkar

722 posts

Ultimate Geek

#119163 27-Mar-2008 20:50

mentalinc:
1gkar: sbiddle,

Cheers. Is your 8500GT HDCP compliant? If so, what make & model? I'm getting bug-eyed trying to find any store info on whether the models they sell are.

They definitely don't assist with volunteering info like most Aussie & USA stores do. As for the manufacturer sites: they (well, MSI do, at least) state it is an optional item, which puts the onus back to the NZ stores. AAARRRRGGGGG!!

The biggest issue is your screen HDCP compliant.
90% of computer LCDS are not HDCP so little point in focussing on that there is plenty of software to get around it , most dont even look at the tag.

Not at present: my main display is a 29" CRT Sony & my projector is a 480p X1. But if I'm to upgrade I will make sure the components are future-proofed, even if some believe it's not neecessary. It may be overkill, but it's one piece I don't have to worry about when I do get the equipment to playback 1080p.

I'm presently looking at a Gigabyte model as it's stated as HDCP. I also could check out Asus if I can ever get past the damned runtime errors their poxy webpage keeps posting.