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Looking at the figures, usage and the costs. I'm leaning towards the fact, we are so lite users of electricity that the initial out lay of a solar system just doesn't stack up.
The kit would pay for itself by the time its end of life.
The little things make the biggest difference.
Shindig:A reputable PV installer should be able to advise reliably on this. They have access to simulation tools that can forecast/model your situation very accurately and so long as they have your best interests at heart can advise what design will work for you.
Looking at the figures, usage and the costs. I'm leaning towards the fact, we are so lite users of electricity that the initial out lay of a solar system just doesn't stack up.
The kit would pay for itself by the time its end of life.
Don't know what region you are in but I can thoroughly recommend our installer here in Taranaki who straight up told us to not include batteries because our usage would never make them viable.
https://www.harmlesssolutions.co.nz/
Shindig:
Looking at the figures, usage and the costs. I'm leaning towards the fact, we are so lite users of electricity that the initial out lay of a solar system just doesn't stack up.
The kit would pay for itself by the time its end of life.
It's the battery that's killing it, that's likely half the cost of the system, maybe the height of the roof as well (if you need scaffolding). Maybe ask what a basic solar only 4-6kW system would cost. With out the battery such a system is likely to be closer to $10k, and you can always add a battery later if you want the independence from the grid.
Lightforce should be able to quote you a cost/usage/ROI optimized system without the battery.
If you have very little electrical load and don't plan to add any soon (EV, electric hot-water, extra AC, Spa etc) it does reduce the benefit of the system. With the right electricity company and export price you should be able to get a small system that will pay for it's self within 7-10 years, cover your use during daylight hours and export enough power to knock a bit off the bill each month.
Also if you are with one of the major banks you can get a green loan to cover the cost of the install with low or zero interest for a number of years. Westpac is 0% for 5 years I think, ANZ 1% for 3 or so year, Kiwibank contribute 3k towards the system cost over 3-4 years.
Has anyone looked into and installed the Enphase micro inverters? I came across some good YouTube videos over the weekend that really liked them. I came to the conclusion they are good where shading is a potential issue. The tests between string inverter and the micros shown in full sun the string inverter as generating the most, as soon as shade was introduced the micros started to win.
Thought?
The little things make the biggest difference.
If you look or search past quite a few previous pages in this thread, I think I did and someone else also put some link youtube video and article showing that modern string inverters from like of SMA and Fronius do just as well job as micro invterter in regards to shading. IMO the advantage micros have now is individual panel monitoring if thats really needed.
I discussed the impact of partial shading with our installer. His take was that better quality newer panels have more interconectiveness between the individual cells in each panel so the effects partial shading are minimised to only the percentage of actual panel being shaded as the current can find its way around the compromised area.
We have an 8.2kW Fronius string inverter and the quality of the data it provides is impressive. I suspect that a system using microinverters could perform as well.
ETA @billgates, our Fronius is able to report individual outputs from the two arrays of panels we have connected to it. As you suggest, the value of deriving outputs from individual panels is of dubious value.
https://www.harmlesssolutions.co.nz/
Would anyone who's in the know be able to give me any info on a couple of quotes I have below? my thoughts are that while REC seems to be a premium panel company the Jinko Tiger Neo panels are probably better than the TwinPeak panels? does the price stack up with todays rates?
18 x Jinko JKM440N-54HL4-V (440w) solar panels rated at a 7.92 kW
1 x Fronius Gen24 6.0 Standard inverter rated at 6 kW AC output
$18,029.47
vs
20 x REC Solar TwinPeak 5 REC405TP5 (405W) 8.1 kW
1 x Fronius Primo GEN24 Plus Primo GEN24 6.0 Plus (AS4777-2 2020) (6kW)
$17,013.85
Shindig:Has anyone looked into and installed the Enphase micro inverters?
We sort of defaulted to Enphase even though that wasn't the original plan for a bunch of reasons, the main one being that with an oddly angled roof and panels in various locations to fit two strings aren't going to cut it. You end up paying a bit more, but also get a lot more flexibility in terms of adding extra panels and batteries and whatnot at a later date. Their app also allows you to set times for free power so you can tell the system to top up the batteries from the grid without having to fiddle with dozens of custom attributes and settings on the charge controller.
harmonist:
Would anyone who's in the know be able to give me any info on a couple of quotes I have below? my thoughts are that while REC seems to be a premium panel company the Jinko Tiger Neo panels are probably better than the TwinPeak panels? does the price stack up with todays rates?
18 x Jinko JKM440N-54HL4-V (440w) solar panels rated at a 7.92 kW
1 x Fronius Gen24 6.0 Standard inverter rated at 6 kW AC output
$18,029.47
vs
20 x REC Solar TwinPeak 5 REC405TP5 (405W) 8.1 kW
1 x Fronius Primo GEN24 Plus Primo GEN24 6.0 Plus (AS4777-2 2020) (6kW)
$17,013.85
Would the REC + Fronius be a better option from the reputation of the hardware? Can you push to the REC Alpha Pure-R series?
Another question if I may: Is there still a cost to Fronius to update the firmware (Fronius UP program) to allow installation of a battery? If so, what is the indicative cost... I have been quoted $1265 for the pleasure!
The little things make the biggest difference.
neb:Shindig:We sort of defaulted to Enphase even though that wasn't the original plan for a bunch of reasons, the main one being that with an oddly angled roof and panels in various locations to fit two strings aren't going to cut it. You end up paying a bit more, but also get a lot more flexibility in terms of adding extra panels and batteries and whatnot at a later date. Their app also allows you to set times for free power so you can tell the system to top up the batteries from the grid without having to fiddle with dozens of custom attributes and settings on the charge controller.
Has anyone looked into and installed the Enphase micro inverters?
Dismissed the Enphase micro inverters as our roof gets no shade all day in the summer.
The little things make the biggest difference.
Shindig:Dismissed the Enphase micro inverters as our roof gets no shade all day in the summer.
Yeah, in our case it was a combination of factors, Fronius and a few others (e.g. Huawei) take forever to switch from grid to battery so everything loses power during an outage, couldn't find any installers in Auckland for SMA which was the original choice, Victron was indoors only which wouldn't work, etc.
Im going to be looking into this soon in Auckland. Will be looking at similar to what harmonist was getting, approximately 8kw of panels and 6kw of inverter. Would like the ability to interface with EV charging in the future and also batteries.
Any suggestions on who to approach for quotes in the Auckland (South Auckland) area?
Oh, and if you're going with batteries, google "tare loss", reading the Enphase forums that's come as a surprise to some people.
I stumbled upon this Youtube channel recently. 'Gary' has some of the best simple to understand solar I've seen. The pros and cons of the likes of AC v.s DC coupled batteries in this one is great.
https://www.harmlesssolutions.co.nz/
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