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Fred99
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  #2681129 26-Mar-2021 15:48
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antonknee:

 

Zoonotic (animal to human) transmission is downright scary. I know its not a popular opinion, but the way humanity treats and uses animals is a recipe for disaster - factory farming, wild animal markets, etc etc. Think about a lot of the recent scares (SARS, H1N1, bird flu, MERS, Covid) which are all zoonotic in origin, and something like 75% of emerging infectious diseases are zoonotic in origin.

 

 

True, but the very worst risk is probably not directly from usual domestic farmed livestock that we've been living alongside for millennia and sharing contagious diseases with, but new diseases that we've never been exposed to through either wild food from species we've never had much contact with but either food shortages makes us hunt them, or we move into their habitat because we're running out of places to live or farm, or habitat destruction means the animals move to where we are, or a worse risk:

 

It looks like Covid in humans may have originated not from a "wild" intermediate vector, but an intensely farmed species - could be pangolins or bamboo rats or something else - that became infected from the original source - assumed to be bats.  Zoonoses generally aren't initially well-adapted to infect other species, and those species which may have acted as an intermediate host probably living not in their natural environment with relatively sparse density, but grouped together. When the first bamboo rat got infected then it probably wasn't easily transmitted between them, but the unusual / artificial high density means it's more likely to jump from host to host, add humans to the mix (probably tending those animals) and once it's jumped to us and jumps back and forth, the chance of it adapting to become what it is - a highly contagious human disease is high.

 

Not saying that farming the animals we do for food (ie in NZ) is a perfectly safe idea, but it's much safer than large scale commercial farming of exotic species that still have contact with their wild relatives, and that live with and are in constant contact with humans.

 

If there's a TLDR, then it's probably "there are too many people on the planet". 




Daynger
435 posts

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  #2681209 26-Mar-2021 16:58
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antonknee:

 

Zoonotic (animal to human) transmission is downright scary. I know its not a popular opinion, but the way humanity treats and uses animals is a recipe for disaster - factory farming, wild animal markets, etc etc. Think about a lot of the recent scares (SARS, H1N1, bird flu, MERS, Covid) which are all zoonotic in origin, and something like 75% of emerging infectious diseases are zoonotic in origin.

 

In other news, community case in Queensland with unknown origin (ie actual community transmission). No lockdown or other response at the moment but contact tracing underway and social distancing/masks encouraged.

 

 

 

 

I read one article which theorised that the covid didnt jump to humans in the Wuhan market, but more likely at a farm supplying the market, then the market was the dense population to give an initial spread.

 

Roughly they think it may have gone:

 

Animal

 

Farmer

 

Market shop staff

 

Customers

 

Other market staff and customers

 

On and out from there.


Geektastic
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  #2681221 26-Mar-2021 17:35
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I was reading an article about the requirement for vaccine passports on international flights in future.

Given that you already have to have an actual passport to make such a flight is there a reason why that passport cannot be used to achieve the same thing rather than creating a whole different system based on the assumption everyone has a smartphone (according to the article that’s how it would work). Visa stickers could easily be adapted to be evidence of vaccination. They already work internationally, have holographic security etc etc.

It seems a missed opportunity to adopt the simplest solution by creation of a more complex one.







Oblivian
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  #2681257 26-Mar-2021 19:39
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Geektastic: I was reading an article about the requirement for vaccine passports on international flights in future.

Given that you already have to have an actual passport to make such a flight is there a reason why that passport cannot be used to achieve the same thing rather than creating a whole different system based on the assumption everyone has a smartphone (according to the article that’s how it would work). Visa stickers could easily be adapted to be evidence of vaccination. They already work internationally, have holographic security etc etc.

It seems a missed opportunity to adopt the simplest solution by creation of a more complex one.

 

Unless the plan has changed, we invest in Idemia here for the smartgates. And they were working on a digital version that at a glance I would suggest would be passport integrated

 

https://www.biometricupdate.com/202101/idemia-working-on-digital-health-passport-for-borders-with-kiwi-immunity-detection-company 


richms
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  #2681262 26-Mar-2021 20:00
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Is there any other alternate source to get the vaccine other than this planned MOH rollout of it? Like for flu how workplaces can book it in to get someone in to give the shots for money. I would rather pay someone if it means I can get it now rather than have to wait for a govt provided one.





Richard rich.ms

Oblivian
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  #2681264 26-Mar-2021 20:12
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richms:

 

Is there any other alternate source to get the vaccine other than this planned MOH rollout of it? Like for flu how workplaces can book it in to get someone in to give the shots for money. I would rather pay someone if it means I can get it now rather than have to wait for a govt provided one.

 

 

Nope.

 

Only compassionate or significant national importance travel

 

https://www.health.govt.nz/our-work/diseases-and-conditions/covid-19-novel-coronavirus/covid-19-vaccines/covid-19-getting-vaccine/covid-19-applying-early-vaccine-travel#criteria 

 

Bit of a controversial post on herald social medias today made all the 'new world order' crowd come out to play. Even frontline staff that refuse will be taken off the frontline. Of course none read it and started to say 'you can't fire them..' 'human rights..' etc etc

 

https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/morningreport/audio/2018789124/workers-who-refuse-vaccination-to-be-removed-from-front-line 


Handle9
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  #2681265 26-Mar-2021 20:12
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richms:

Is there any other alternate source to get the vaccine other than this planned MOH rollout of it? Like for flu how workplaces can book it in to get someone in to give the shots for money. I would rather pay someone if it means I can get it now rather than have to wait for a govt provided one.



No. Vaccine tourism will become a thing later in the year but it's still severely supply constrained.

 
 
 

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sbiddle
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  #2681266 26-Mar-2021 20:14
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richms:

 

Is there any other alternate source to get the vaccine other than this planned MOH rollout of it? Like for flu how workplaces can book it in to get someone in to give the shots for money. I would rather pay someone if it means I can get it now rather than have to wait for a govt provided one.

 

 

There has been plenty of speculation about private vaccine rollouts in NZ. Nothing has eventuated yet.

 

The only vaccine approved for NZ is Pfizer, so somebody would need to be acquiring this to offer it here.

 

 

 

 


wellygary
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  #2681278 26-Mar-2021 21:38
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Not what you want to hear in Queensland on a Friday night ... at least one undetected transmission step

“ BREAKING: Genomic testing has confirmed that Queensland’s latest locally acquired COVID-19 case is linked to the previous cluster announced on March 12. ”

ezbee
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  #2681400 27-Mar-2021 13:27
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Was there the expected 1pm update on testing the exercise bus passengers today ?
I have not seen a 1pn numbers update in usual places, just yesterdays.

 

Edit, Oh Ok there was this at 2pm, so I guess that is it, all good so far.

 

Covid-19: One case in managed isolation, one new historical case. | RNZ News

 

 


sbiddle
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  #2681440 27-Mar-2021 15:40
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ezbee:

 

Was there the expected 1pm update on testing the exercise bus passengers today ?
I have not seen a 1pn numbers update in usual places, just yesterdays.

 

Edit, Oh Ok there was this at 2pm, so I guess that is it, all good so far.

 

Covid-19: One case in managed isolation, one new historical case. | RNZ News

 

 

 

 

Updates came in but no word if buses to exercise venues have been resumed or whether these will stay suspended.

 

The simple reality is while we (and other countries) continue to use hotels for quarantine there is always going to be a significant risk of spread due to the basic way air conditioning systems are designed and operate in many of these properties.

 

 

 

 

 

 


sbiddle
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  #2681444 27-Mar-2021 15:51
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Batman:

 

looks like AU have vax problems too

 

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/mar/27/australias-covid-vaccine-rollout-and-why-it-has-gps-beating-their-heads-against-a-wall

 

 

 

 

Some of Australia's problems are of their own making though. They've already got millions of doses that have been produced of the AstraZeneca vaccine (production started in November), but it was only on Monday that the TGA approved use of the Australian manufactured vaccine.


cshwone
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  #2681447 27-Mar-2021 15:54
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richms:

 

Is there any other alternate source to get the vaccine other than this planned MOH rollout of it? Like for flu how workplaces can book it in to get someone in to give the shots for money. I would rather pay someone if it means I can get it now rather than have to wait for a govt provided one.

 

 

Really?


sbiddle
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  #2681449 27-Mar-2021 16:06
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cshwone:

 

richms:

 

Is there any other alternate source to get the vaccine other than this planned MOH rollout of it? Like for flu how workplaces can book it in to get someone in to give the shots for money. I would rather pay someone if it means I can get it now rather than have to wait for a govt provided one.

 

 

Really?

 

 

I don't see anything wrong with that viewpoint, nor people seeking out the vaccine.

 

I think the approach by the govt this week to grant exceptions for vaccines to some people heading overseas is logical, but the strict criteria is just stupid. IMHO every single person leaving NZ who will be coming back to NZ within the next few months (with the exception for Australia since we're going to have a bubble) should be vaccinated as a priority before leaving NZ. The facts aren't hard to grasp - MIQ is the weakest link, and we need to be doing everything we can to prevent Covid entering the MIQ system. Every person in that system who is vaccinated reduces the risk.

 

I know a couple of people heading overseas in the next few months who are slightly worried at present about how they'll be vaccinated. They'd happily pay $$ for a private vaccination before going.

 

 

 

 

 

 


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