In the market for a replacement car and looking for advice

Forums › Transport (cars, bikes and boats) › In the market for a replacement car and looking for advice - six+ seats

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alasta

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#3197661 19-Feb-2024 20:25

mattwnz:

The only problem I had was a faulty infotainment system. It would freeze or lag, or fail to boot intermittently on startup. They ended up replacing a module in it which fixed it, but it was frustrating to get it resolved as they thought firmware updates would fix it, which didn't. But come across other owners who had have had similar issues with it.

The old MZD Connect system was terrible. It felt like a high school computer science project. The newer system I have in the CX-30 is much better but I tend to always use CarPlay anyway.

The other issue is the 6 month service cycle when it is 12 months overseas is another annoyance.

It was a six month interval on my Mazda3 but 12 months on my CX-5 and CX-30. I'm not sure if that's because of Mazda extending the intervals on newer examples or whether it's because of my Mazda3 being diesel, but definitely something for the OP to keep in mind when looking at second hand Mazdas.

Lizard1977

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#3201443 29-Feb-2024 11:08

Latest update - I drove a 2018 Subaru Exiga in Auckland last week. It was okay, much better than the older Exiga I test-drove a few weeks back, but still not quite as good as I'd like (particularly for the price they were asking). I also drove a 2019 CX-8 but found it quite "wallowy". No idea if this is typical for the model, or if it was just that particular car, so I would be looking to drive other models (or the CX-9) to get a better sense for how it drives.

While I'm still considering the options (and evaluating how necessary the "six seater" criterion is), I'm also starting to think about vehicle finance. It would be nice to get a pre-approval so I have some assurance of the budget I have to work with. Are there any finance options that people recommend (or ones I should steer well clear of)?

blackjack17

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#3201455 29-Feb-2024 11:17

Lizard1977:

Latest update - I drove a 2018 Subaru Exiga in Auckland last week. It was okay, much better than the older Exiga I test-drove a few weeks back, but still not quite as good as I'd like (particularly for the price they were asking). I also drove a 2019 CX-8 but found it quite "wallowy". No idea if this is typical for the model, or if it was just that particular car, so I would be looking to drive other models (or the CX-9) to get a better sense for how it drives.

While I'm still considering the options (and evaluating how necessary the "six seater" criterion is), I'm also starting to think about vehicle finance. It would be nice to get a pre-approval so I have some assurance of the budget I have to work with. Are there any finance options that people recommend (or ones I should steer well clear of)?

The CX9 is thirsty on the open road (as is the cx5). One of my line managers has just needed a transmission replacement on his 2023 CX9.

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Lizard1977

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#3201998 1-Mar-2024 13:45

I've put in an application through Simplify for pre-approved finance - waiting to see how that goes. In the meantime, I took out a Mitsubishi Outlander - 2019 LS, 2.0L petrol. While it felt quite "large" it drove nicely. I did an open-road run to check the economy (using the trip computer, reset, and the average L/100km calculation). Over about 40kms, the average economy was about 7.6L/100kms. I did a shorter trip around town (again, reset the trip computer) in Eco-Mode and it was 7.9L/100kms (though it was much shorter - I ran out of time to do a more extensive drive). While far from scientific, it does give an indication of the likely fuel economy, using the car as I'm likely to do if I bought it. It's an ex-lease car with full service history. 145K kms, and it's pretty tidy both in and out.

Anyone have any specific thoughts about the Outlander? It meets the 6+ seats criterion (which isn't necessary, but would be nice). Fuel economy seems okay. The LS model is base spec but it has Carplay built in, cruise control and adjustable speed limiter (which I like).

The other one I'm looking at is a 2016 Outlander PHEV. It's only done 55K kms, but the "claimed" economy of the PHEV model would offer up substantial savings (even if it was only half of what it claims). A lot of my driving is for relatively short distances in town (<10-15kms) so I would expect to be able to make good use of the EV mode. It's not 6+ seats though (seems like Mitsubishi only introduced the 7 seat PHEV in 2022), but again this might not be a deal breaker for me.

jonb

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#3202072 1-Mar-2024 14:38

The early generation Outlander PHEV would need a bit of buyer diligence, I remember this thread [URL]https://www.geekzone.co.nz/forums.asp?forumid=162&topicid=288380&page_no=2[url] a while ago where the battery range degraded rapidly for a 2016 model ( the actual EV battery is pretty small and not designed to be used everyday ?) . Also now requires Road User Charges as a plug in hybrid.

Lizard1977

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#3202098 1-Mar-2024 15:17

Thanks. Interesting reading.

Is it possible to see the battery State of Health (SOH) from the dashboard of the car, or do you need a dongle to read the OBD data? I'm going to take a look at the 2016 PHEV tomorrow (also seen a 2014 PHEV, which is much cheaper obviously, but would be interesting to see what kind of state the battery is in).

Handle9

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#3202110 1-Mar-2024 15:50

We've had a couple of Outlanders. Mr Handle drives a 2019 but the 2.4l version.

Like most Mitsubishis they aren't the most refined car but they are a lot of car for the money, a well proven design and relatively cheap to fix when things go wrong.

While it's a smaller car than my Pajero it's load space is longer.

There are stacks of them around so getting support is easy. If you like the car go for it.

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jonathan18

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#3202372 2-Mar-2024 12:49

As per an earlier comment, with the introduction of RUCs for PHEVs one has to really do one’s homework to ensure it is worth it as an option. This is especially the case when looking at older PHEVs, and more so the Outlander as earlier models of this are well-known for suffering battery degradation. Given there’s talk of some owners of old PHEVs looking at removing the charging ability of their cars so as to try to avoid having to pay RUCs shows that for those cars that have a low EV-only range it’s not an economical choice.

Lizard1977

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#3202902 3-Mar-2024 21:25

I did a couple of test drives this weekend.

I took out the 2015 PHEV Outlander. It was very nice to drive, it felt quite refined and comfortable, and had enough power. But I saw no way to check the battery state of health. The dealer said it had a range of about 30kms on battery alone. It wasn't fully charged when I took it out - maybe 80%? - and it showed only 20kms of range. With the mix of systems - EV mode, EV mode with petrol charging, and "normal" mode - it was quite hard to test it all in a short test drive and get some reliable info about the fuel economy. But suffice to say I saw nothing like the claimed 2.7L/100km economy. While I will admit that a more robust set of tests, or a longer drive, might reveal better economy, my unscientific test suggested an economy of no better than 11L/100kms. My fiddling about with the different modes would likely have added up to uncertain results.

When I spoke to the dealer about the battery, he demonstrated very vague knowledge of the battery/PHEV system. I enquired about the battery state of health and got a hand-wavey answer about it's got a range of 30kms. When I pushed, he said he'd have to get the techs to take a look and come back to me, and then started to try and "close" the deal. Gave me a bit of an icky feeling - I don't like pushy salespeople - but I suspect I'll get a call from them on Mondya to try and push the deal through. Based on what I've read here about the problems with older PHEV Outlanders and the battery degradation issue, I think I'd only be interested if they could include some MBI that covers the battery. No point paying a premium for a PHEV system that offers no additional benefits in a year or so. Especially with the RUCs applying. I crunched some numbers and based on the number of KMs I drive each year (~8000, with about 80% happening in short trips around town), the fuel cost of a PHEV even with the RUCs would be cheaper than my gas-guzzling faulty Subaru. But if the PHEV system offers no tangible benefits and the fuel economy is no better (or even worse) than the petrol Outlander I drove on Friday, then why pay the extra? Also, the stereo in the PHEV was rubbish, and wouldn't connect to my iPhone, no Carplay or even functional bluetooth.

I then drove a 2019 VW Tiguan Allspace 1.4P turbo with 66kms on the clock for $27K. It was, in a word, lovely. This is the second Tiguan I've driven and I really liked it. The model I drove was the lower spec Comfortline version, but even the base level of kit was pretty decent. It was a pleasure to drive, and had enough power for my needs. But then I came home and googled for more info on Tiguans, including a GZ search. I discovered that the 1.4P Tiguan engine is underpowered for the size of the vehicle, and is prone to additional stress over its life - apparently the 2L model is much better. I also read several threads here which warned about the fate of people who buy second hand "euro" cars like VWs. This was a real downer for me, because the Tiguan seemed to tick all of my boxes. But in these financially strained times I really don't want to be buying a maintenance headache. It really needs to be cheap to run and maintain for a good few years, and I fear that the Tiguan would not meet either of those criteria. Even with MBI, the regular maintenance sounds like it would be costly.

I had hoped to find a CX-8 or CX-9 to drive, but there are none in Palmy in my price range (<$25k at the most. I only included the Tiguan because I hope to get a couple of grand trade-in and squeak under the limit).

Right now, it's looking like a toss up between the generally affordable and reliable Mistubishi Outlander petrol, or the flashier and nicer but more expensive and costly Tiguan.

Anyone care to throw any other thoughts or comments into the mix? Have I over-estimated the problems of the "euro" car? Are the Outlanders not as reliable or affordable as I've assumed? Is there something significant I've overlooked? I have looked for similar six-seaters in other makes - like the Sante Fe - but most of the other options are too costly, or come with very high KMs. If the options in the six-seater range aren't going to work, then I may have to concede that I can't meet that objective, and fall back to a 5-seater wagon of some kind (which, for my money, might be a Mazda 6 wagon or a more up-to-date Subaru).

Lizard1977

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#3216466 10-Apr-2024 09:12

Just to close off this thread. I decided in the end to go with the 2017 Outlander PHEV. It might not be the safest choice - lots of people have warned about the potential battery issues, and the impact of RUCs for PHEVs - but it's going to strike a pretty good balance for me. It doesn't have six+ seats, but that was something I had to sacrifice. It would have been nice to have the option to transport the whole whanau at once, but it wasn't essential. The only car I found which I really liked that would have fit that criteria was the VW Tiguan, but I had to exclude it based on the potential service and repair costs. When even the mechanic who would stand to gain financially from my purchase warns me against buying a VW, that's when you know you're in for a costly car. When I excluded six+ seats, there were more options to choose from, but the Outlander felt the most comfortable, the best set of features, the best price, and the best fuel economy (fingers crossed for the PHEV - my use case should be a good match for it). I guess only time will tell.

Batman

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#3216468 10-Apr-2024 09:23

Lizard1977:

Just to close off this thread. I decided in the end to go with the 2017 Outlander PHEV. It might not be the safest choice - lots of people have warned about the potential battery issues, and the impact of RUCs for PHEVs - but it's going to strike a pretty good balance for me. It doesn't have six+ seats, but that was something I had to sacrifice. It would have been nice to have the option to transport the whole whanau at once, but it wasn't essential. The only car I found which I really liked that would have fit that criteria was the VW Tiguan, but I had to exclude it based on the potential service and repair costs. When even the mechanic who would stand to gain financially from my purchase warns me against buying a VW, that's when you know you're in for a costly car. When I excluded six+ seats, there were more options to choose from, but the Outlander felt the most comfortable, the best set of features, the best price, and the best fuel economy (fingers crossed for the PHEV - my use case should be a good match for it). I guess only time will tell.

is the Outlander less wallowy than the CX-8 ?

Lizard1977

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#3216469 10-Apr-2024 09:27

In my experience, with several test drives, yes. Don't get me wrong - the Outlander is never going to be as good as my Subaru at hugging the corners, but I put the Outlanders through similar routes as the CX-8 I drove and it felt more composed.

martyyn

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#3217001 11-Apr-2024 10:42

Lizard1977:

When even the mechanic who would stand to gain financially from my purchase warns me against buying a VW, that's when you know you're in for a costly car.

IME a mechanic will say this when they've no experience of working on said manufacturer. You can't expect mechanics to know everything about every different manufacturer let alone all the models in a single manufacturer.

I know a number of mechanics locally who will only work on old, cheap, Japanese cars because that's all people around here drive.

My three BMW's are quite a range, a 2021 i3, a 2006 M5, and a 1990 535is. All go to the same BMW specialist but each car is worked on by a different mechanic.

Lizard1977

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#3217053 11-Apr-2024 12:34

martyyn:

Lizard1977:

When even the mechanic who would stand to gain financially from my purchase warns me against buying a VW, that's when you know you're in for a costly car.

IME a mechanic will say this when they've no experience of working on said manufacturer. You can't expect mechanics to know everything about every different manufacturer let alone all the models in a single manufacturer.

Ordinarily I would agree with this statement. However, in this case, the workshop specialised in European and VW cars. That was why I queried the servicing costs with them, to compare to the dealer-supplied service costs. He had lots of experience working with VW models, and acknowledged that they are good cars but are very expensive to maintain and repair.

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