EV (electric vehicle) News & Discussion

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974 posts

Ultimate Geek

Subscriber

#3024697 20-Jan-2023 10:17

GV27:

lchiu7:

Slighly different topic but I have been trying to find a 20A charger for my Atto3 that only needs to have a caravan plug wired in the garage. Type 2 chargers like this seem to be out of stock or really expensive

I have found Type 1 portable chargers like this

https://smartevchargers.co.nz/shop/plug-in-ev-chargers/16a-ev-charger-blue-caravan-plug/

and just was wondering if I could use an adapter like this to work for my car with its Type 2 socket.

https://www.trademe.co.nz/a/motors/car-parts-accessories/batteries-chargers/listing/3959605307

I would seriously recommend you take advantage of 7kw charging at home if you can afford to get it installed. The actual wallbox doesn't have to be terribly smart if you can set charge timers in the car - the cheapest EVPOWER box is $699.

I've been living off 1.7kw three-pin sockets and I have to plug it in the second I get home to cover my trip to and from work the next day. It's bougie hell. I've got a wallbox to fit to my next house and I'm hoping for a 6.6kva PDM from a wrecker in Europe at some point, which will radically transform how usable my car is.

Also 7Kw provides more opportunity to gain from a 'free power hour' or scheduled off peak rates (based on your own supplier. Initiating your charging on your arrival home from work is the worst possible practice in terms of peak grid demand mitigation.

https://www.harmlesssolutions.co.nz/

HarmLessSolutions

974 posts

Ultimate Geek

Subscriber

#3024698 20-Jan-2023 10:19

exador:

As per my post above, Hertz charged me $13.80 for 38km of electricity. Would have been cheaper to hire an ICE!

Out of interest what price per kWh is that?

ETA. Hertz's requirement would also seem to incentivise charging to 100% to avoid these OTT charging costs. Counterproductive much?

https://www.harmlesssolutions.co.nz/

GV27

5897 posts

Uber Geek

#3024708 20-Jan-2023 10:38

HarmLessSolutions:

Also 7Kw provides more opportunity to gain from a 'free power hour' or scheduled off peak rates (based on your own supplier. Initiating your charging on your arrival home from work is the worst possible practice in terms of peak grid demand mitigation.

Yea, it's very much an interim thing. I bought the wall unit when the car was on the boat here and in the interim we've committed to moving house. So I'm literally hanging a cable out my office window and plugging into a wall socket with the car parked on the lawn. At 1.7kw I have to plug it in the second I get in to get enough juice in to cover my commute the next day before I need to lock windows up at night and head to bed.

The wall unit will give me *up to 32amp* of charge when I get the car or mod the Leaf to take it, but for now 3kw would be helpful. From 11pm to 5am is 120km of usable range at optimal time given 95% efficiency. If I can get the 6kva PDM then I can almost fully charge it between getting home from work and going out at night with friends for a drive.

lchiu7

6476 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

#3024716 20-Jan-2023 10:50

GV27:

lchiu7:

Slighly different topic but I have been trying to find a 20A charger for my Atto3 that only needs to have a caravan plug wired in the garage. Type 2 chargers like this seem to be out of stock or really expensive

I have found Type 1 portable chargers like this

https://smartevchargers.co.nz/shop/plug-in-ev-chargers/16a-ev-charger-blue-caravan-plug/

and just was wondering if I could use an adapter like this to work for my car with its Type 2 socket.

https://www.trademe.co.nz/a/motors/car-parts-accessories/batteries-chargers/listing/3959605307

I would seriously recommend you take advantage of 7kw charging at home if you can afford to get it installed. The actual wallbox doesn't have to be terribly smart if you can set charge timers in the car - the cheapest EVPOWER box is $699.

I've been living off 1.7kw three-pin sockets and I have to plug it in the second I get home to cover my trip to and from work the next day. It's bougie hell. I've got a wallbox to fit to my next house and I'm hoping for a 6.6kva PDM from a wrecker in Europe at some point, which will radically transform how usable my car is.

A type 1 charging adapter is about $500 and then factor in the cost of a sparkie to to replace a standard outlet with a caravan plug should not be too expensive.

I might check out the adapter. I did find a cheaper one on on Ali but I wonder if it needs a compliance cert.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005004526979868.html

That setup is way cheaper than $2Kish I gave seen for 7kW chargers but of course slower.

My power plan gives me 14c/kWh from 9pm to 7am so I just charge my car then. Plus my retailer (Genesis) gives me some free power (just got an allocation) so I can take advantage of that also.

Plus I don't commute in the car so I don't need to even charge every night with the standard Granny charger and I can keep the car fairly well topped up.

RunningMan

8960 posts

Uber Geek

#3024725 20-Jan-2023 11:10

lchiu7:

Slighly different topic but I have been trying to find a 20A charger for my Atto3 that only needs to have a caravan plug wired in the garage.

Caravan plug - 16 amp. 20 amp from caravan plug = fire.

https://oemaudio.co.nz/electric-vehicle-charging-products/Type-2-Vehicles-Ex-UK-or-NZ-new/

GV27

5897 posts

Uber Geek

#3024726 20-Jan-2023 11:11

lchiu7:

A type 1 charging adapter is about $500 and then factor in the cost of a sparkie to to replace a standard outlet with a caravan plug should not be too expensive.

I might check out the adapter. I did find a cheaper one on on Ali but I wonder if it needs a compliance cert.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005004526979868.html

That setup is way cheaper than $2Kish I gave seen for 7kW chargers but of course slower.

My power plan gives me 14c/kWh from 9pm to 7am so I just charge my car then. Plus my retailer (Genesis) gives me some free power (just got an allocation) so I can take advantage of that also.

Plus I don't commute in the car so I don't need to even charge every night with the standard Granny charger and I can keep the car fairly well topped up.

For myself the sparkie cost was ultimately driven by the distance from the switchboard, which was largely going to be the same whether I went for a caravan socket or a wall unit. So the real marginal cost was the cost of a wall unit over the caravan adapter (I already bought a three pin socket one for emergencies and as an interim measure).

This is what I went with - $899 1Phase option with app support to set charging timers - Type 2 socketed so I can charge different types of car if people have their own cables.

https://evpower.co.nz/electric-vehicle-charging-products/ev-wallchargers/?ajaxfilter=price,732-1199/tag,bcp

If I had known I was going to move to the kind of place we're looking at/making an offer on, I would have just held fire and got an EVNEX unit fitted but I didn't think it would be a good option at our current house with the long cable install we needed. If you can get the 'standard' install (close to your power board) then it's a really competitive price, and EK had a $150 promo at one point too.

everettpsycho

614 posts

Ultimate Geek

#3024941 20-Jan-2023 19:57

GV27:
I would seriously recommend you take advantage of 7kw charging at home if you can afford to get it installed. The actual wallbox doesn't have to be terribly smart if you can set charge timers in the car - the cheapest EVPOWER box is $699.

I've been living off 1.7kw three-pin sockets and I have to plug it in the second I get home to cover my trip to and from work the next day. It's bougie hell. I've got a wallbox to fit to my next house and I'm hoping for a 6.6kva PDM from a wrecker in Europe at some point, which will radically transform how usable my car is.

I'm interested in his the pdm transplant goes, I'd love to upgrade my leaf to the 6.6kw charger so I can get more use of the free chargers and the one at work. At the moment with a 50km trip each way and sharing the charger between us all I can only really get 2 hours at most and it doesn't even cover the journey one way.

Also worth remembering meridian customers can get 10% off at OEM audio on some stuff to bring prices down. We went for 7kW chargers at our place mainly to future proof for our next vehicle and by the time we paid a sparky to run the wires, install the caravan socket and then buy the 16A cable to use it we were already a sizeable way to just putting in actual smart chargers. Its also good that one at least is load balanced so we don't blow the fuse at the boundary, it's only shut off the charging once but it's nice to know it works and stoos that happening.

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kingdragonfly

11202 posts

Uber Geek

Subscriber

#3024956 20-Jan-2023 20:43

Hydrogen for vehicles has been discussed in this forum previously.

This from the Green car congress>

"The number of hydrogen stations deployed globally has surpassed the 1,000-mark, according to a study by Information Trends. China represents roughly one-third of global deployments, but the US lags far behind with less than 100 hydrogen stations.

The second highest hydrogen station deployments after China are in Japan, followed by Korea, said Shakeel Ahmed, Senior Analyst at Information Trends. Other Asia-Pacific countries with aggressive plans for hydrogen station deployments include Australia, New Zealand, and India. Another four Asia-Pacific countries have also deployed hydrogen stations."

Here's a Youtube video from a physicist who think hydrogen for vehicles is a bad idea.

Hydrogen Will Not Save Us. Here's Why.

Sabine Hossenfelder

exador

95 posts

Master Geek

#3025546 22-Jan-2023 15:32

HarmLessSolutions:

exador:

As per my post above, Hertz charged me $13.80 for 38km of electricity. Would have been cheaper to hire an ICE!

Out of interest what price per kWh is that?

ETA. Hertz's requirement would also seem to incentivise charging to 100% to avoid these OTT charging costs. Counterproductive much?

$0.80 p/kw. In the case of the Polestar 2, charging is limited to 90% and you're expected to top it up to that before returning.

HarmLessSolutions

974 posts

Ultimate Geek

Subscriber

#3025552 22-Jan-2023 15:47

80c/kWh is the standard charge by ChargeNet now so fair charge on that basis. $13.80 calculates to 17.25kWh so 38km doesn't ring true (2.2km/kWh), unless you're driving it like you stole it 😲 (About 5.3km/kWh is normal)

The 90% recommended maximum charge limit can be overridden manually but in DC charging situations the charger is likely to quit in the mid 90s if you try this as the declining charge rate will cause it to trip out. Been there done that. I have a Polestar2 SRSM and will charge to 100% at home before a long journey so if you have AC charging available this would be a workaround to avoid a charge fee on return but as they're only passing on their ChargeNet cost why bother.

ETA: Worth noting that ChargeNet's new rate results in a cost of about 16c/km for charging (based on Polestar efficiency) which when combined with the RUC charges EVs will attract from March 2024 (assuming ~7c/km is applied as per diesels now) will result in 23c/km so close to the current petrol cost for a similar vehicle. For those that are largely/totally reliant on public charging this may become a deal breaker and makes home charging (particularly from PV) extremely attractive.

https://www.harmlesssolutions.co.nz/

exador

95 posts

Master Geek

#3025557 22-Jan-2023 16:03

HarmLessSolutions:

$13.80 calculates to 17.25kWh so 38km doesn't ring true (2.2km/kWh), unless you're driving it like you stole it 😲 (About 5.3km/kWh is normal)

Isn't that how you're supposed to drive rental cars? ;)

Mehrts

1063 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

#3025561 22-Jan-2023 16:33

exador: Rented a Polestar 2 from Hertz at Wellington Airport yesterday. Nice car - as a Volvo owner it felt very familiar.

Rental conditions a joke though - you’re expected to return it with 90% battery charge. So queue for a charger near airport and wait for how long when you have a flight to catch?

I opted to have them charge it - will be interesting to see the cost.

Oh, and if you return it with less than 15% charge you pay an $80 penalty…

That's totally fair and justified. Rental companies have always charged a premium if you have them refuel the car after dropoff, that's why it's cost beneficial if you do it yourself. Convenience does cost.

See below for the rates that Avis charge (pun included) for their EV's if not returned with more than 77% charge (note that 75% is specified in the rental agreement though).

https://www.avis.co.nz/en/terms-conditions

vexxxboy

4244 posts

Uber Geek

#3025563 22-Jan-2023 16:40

makes for interesting reading and more and more countries are finding the same thing where EV cars are out numbering charge points and power prices are sky rocketing.

https://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/motoring/motoring-features/how-easy-charge-electric-car-25995222

Common sense is not as common as you think.

HarmLessSolutions

974 posts

Ultimate Geek

Subscriber

#3025573 22-Jan-2023 17:24

vexxxboy:

makes for interesting reading and more and more countries are finding the same thing where EV cars are out numbering charge points and power prices are sky rocketing.

https://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/motoring/motoring-features/how-easy-charge-electric-car-25995222

My stepdaughter in the UK has spoken of electricity rates having tripled or better in the last year or so as Russian gas supply has impacted Europe and the UK which will obviously be a factor in both the home and public charging rates stated in the article. This is causing real distress to many Brits.

We are very fortunate here in NZ in not having been exposed to such price hikes in part due to the dominance of renewable generation methods in our grid. The benefit of home charging economies and our typically short journeys make EVs a viable option for most people, particularly those who have PV installed though the lack of public charging availability is becoming problematic as EV numbers increase here. This definitely needs to be addressed or EV uptake will suffer as a result.

https://www.harmlesssolutions.co.nz/

GV27

5897 posts

Uber Geek

#3025641 23-Jan-2023 06:41

everettpsycho:

I'm interested in his the pdm transplant goes, I'd love to upgrade my leaf to the 6.6kw charger so I can get more use of the free chargers and the one at work. At the moment with a 50km trip each way and sharing the charger between us all I can only really get 2 hours at most and it doesn't even cover the journey one way.

So far my biggest problem is finding one. I've got a price, just not a unit.

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