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“The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.” -John Kenneth Galbraith
rb99
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These comments are my own and do not represent the opinions of 2degrees.
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richms:
I am OK with a token chademo charger at these places, so long as it doesn't share a carpark or charger resources with the CCS stalls.
PHEVs shouldn't count, they should not be using fast charge infrastructure because they have a fuel tank, and they dont fast charge.
IMO there should be a lower cut off for charge rates and if you hit that you start to pay the idle fees. Set it to the point where its going to be at that all the time for the slow charging cars to further disincentivize them blocking up chargers.
On fee structure, charge.net use to have this. $0.xx /kWh, Minimum $0.xx/minute (and before that they were 25c/kWh + 25c/min). But they have gone away from this. (I assume for marketing simplicity?)
In my eyes the old structure was a better idea, to encourage those who's charge rates dropped to to a snails pace to move on (and if they don't at least get some decent revenue from them)
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Obraik:
My personal opinion on this is that there should be some regulation put in place on used EV imports that requires importers to convert them to CCS2 charge ports, especially since Japan is going down a different path when it comes to charging connectors. It's not going to be sustainable going forward for the charging networks to support one standard for NZ new vehicles and a completely different one for used imports.
FWIW, it looks like Lexus and Nissan have both moved to CCS for those markets that have that as their standard.
Obraik: I’m not going to pretend that it it’s easy to do, but if the vehicle is sold in a market with CCS then that at least means that the vehicle has parts available that makes it CCS2 capable. That might mean changing out charging modules and charge ports with parts from CCS2 markets.
Drive EV in Taupo already provide this as an optional service for imported Tesla’s
The only model that commercial conversions are currently available is the drive EV one for Tesla Model S. Should note that this isn't a conversion to CCS, but rather a conversion to tesla's version of a type 2 plug (no CCS). It is also fairly steep: $6000 - $7000 depending on model.
https://shop.driveev.co.nz/products/type-2-plug-conversion-for-japanese-tesla-model-s
They also sell CCS adaptors (and I assume the conversion that allows the adaptor to work) for $3000:
https://shop.driveev.co.nz/products/tesla-model-s-ccs-conversion?variant=41182195843106
Note exactly sure how it works, but note that while Drive EV offers a CCS2 to NACS adaptor skipping the requirement for the first work package, as this adaptor is not manufactured by tesla, it's use is considered an unsafe:
https://www.worksafe.govt.nz/dmsdocument/5169-electric-vehicle-charging-safety-guidelines-2nd-edition
Adding $9k - 10k to the cost would kill the viability of a lot of imports.
"but if the vehicle is sold in a market with CCS then that at least means that the vehicle has parts available that makes it CCS2 capable" - A lot of vehicles are not sold with CCS anywhere in the world. Nissan Leaf, Nissan e-nv200, Lexus UX300e. And of course the Kei cars (i-miev, Minicab, Sakura, Ek X, N-Van e). Could add the Tesla Model S & X to this. Originally these were supercharge, AC (and CHAdeMO via adaptor) only, even more recently CCS2 is only available via adaptor.
And of course the cars sold with no DC charging at all (Original Smart ED, Orginal Zoe, Original Merc B class Electric).
Then of course is the fact that automakers aren't fond of grey market imports. If they were they would simply add an English language option, and an option to change radio bands to JDM car's, but they don't and we need to essentially have them hacked to load English and NZ radio bands.
Same deal would apply with a CCS charge hardware - They could well price it super high. And also they could refuse to allow the software change for the different comms requirements of CCS (it's not a simple port swap).
The reality is for a decent number of models we would be dependent on aftermarket conversion's. For many models there slimily isn't the volume to justify an aftermarket solution.
The leaf (& e-NV200) is the main model that would have the volume. To my knowledge only one conversion service exists (and the only locations offered are Netherlands and Ireland / Northen Ireland).
https://www.muxsan.com/English/products.html
Also kinda expensive at Eur3500 (NZD6,300).
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Real question is: Is it worth giving up used import EV's from Japan (and banning CHadeMO only NZ new models from NZ, like the Leaf, UX300e, Outlander PHEV, Eclipse Cross PHEV) to unify on a single fast charge standard.
My take is the answer is no. Last month they made up more than 25% of our registration's. Along with loosing interesting models like the Kei car's, e-nv200 vans etc, a major argument against EV's is they cost to much, and ex Japan EV are a major contributor to getting cheaper used EV's onto our roads.
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How amazing would it have been if the auto industry got together ~3 years before the release of the first wave of modern EV's (Nissan leaf & GM Volt in 2011. Model S & Renault Zoe in 2012), and come up with a charge connector that accommodated global use cases for the next ~30 years (80A single phase capability for North America & japan, 32A three phase capability + ~350kW DC capability). Plus a means (likely a separate plug) to handle Trucks, ferries etc. (perhaps 1MW DC).
Would have avoided format war's, and made international interoperability much easier.
I agree that three DC fast charging standards is nonviable, but two is (as evidenced by our DC charge network over the past decade). I don't think there has been much ChaoJi adoption in Japan, but we can tackle that in the event it does become mainstream (status quo is that there is no provision in NZ and it is not covered in the government public charging guidelines). - Ignoring the Tesla property type 2 charger on S & X for this answer (technically this is a 3rd fast charge format, but all of these cars can charge from CHAdeMO via adaptor, and the more recent or upgraded ones via CCS2 with adapter).
The issue is the capacity allocation between different plug types.
The Z station pictured a few pages ago, has 4% of its charge capacity allocated to CHAdeMO vehicles. Given 32% of the BEV fleet (plus many PHEV)'s have CHAdeMO connectors, clearly this is problematic. While this number is falling (25% of BEV registrations last month were CHAdeMO) it is still a decent chunk of our EV fleet.
The situation is even worse when you consider the impact of Tesla superchargers. I get these are primary built to serve Tesla brand vehicles, so (unless mandated) will never have ports not fitted to tesla cars. But many are open to other brand CCS2 cars. And even if they are not, enough of our EV fleet are Tesla's that they attract many CCS2 cars (model 3 & Y) away from other brand fast chargers.
Combined with aggressive bias to CCS from other providers, it creates situations like Omarana. Town has a 4 stall Tesla supercharger (this one is open to CCS2 cars from other brands). Network Waikiki has a DC charge station with 5 CCS ports and 1 CHAdeMO port. Means the entire town has 9% of it's charge ports to serve 32% of the EV market.
Beyond equity, having a single port sucks. A single breakage is all it takes to cause drama.
On Drive EV conversions.
It is great that Drive EV have made the investment to be able to offer this 3rd party conversions, but the fact they are the only entity that offers this service, that they only offer it for one brand of car, and the type 2 conversion + CCS2 adapter costs $9 - 10k does highlight part of the issue. Used import model S starts at around $40k, so we are getting close to 1/4 of the value.
The muxsan leaf ccs2 conversion is not available in NZ, but if we assume somebody could licence (or independently develop) the product for NZ, and match euro pricing we would be looking at $6300. With 62kWh leaf's starting at around $25k, this is again close to 1/4 of the value of the cars (and far more for smaller battery leaf's).
Reality is, mandating conversions of this cost would mean imports of many ex japan EV's would not be viable, resulting in less choice & higher prices for consumers.
On Nissan / Lexus. Yes they have more recently released CCS2 models, but the Leaf & UX300e remain in production. Unless we are expecting super rapid growth in the EV fleet (we are not seeing that this year), the charging network need to serve the current fleet, no the future (should note on many fast chargers it is viable to swap the cords if we do see a big change in the fleet mix.
Obraik:
New Zealand's EV rollout is going to suffer if something isn't done to control the amount of different charging formats that are coming into the country. Importers of Japanese vehicles aren't going to care and will just import whatever they can get their hands on, even if that means the buyer will have a terrible experience. We already have some restrictions on what can be imported or modification requirements to allow an import - charging ports should be added to that too.
So yes, I do think it's worth restricting imports in the name of making things easier for consumers.
https://nzta.govt.nz/assets/planning/EV-connectors-and-socket-outlet-recommendations.pdf
Now we have made changes to this before. (There used to be a recommendation that a type 2 socket outlet be included to serve relatively fast AC charging vehicles - It would have been written with the Renault Zoe in mind, and subsequently dropped when the AC fast(ish) charging approach of the Zoe did not get widely adopted by automakers), and could again.
https://web.archive.org/web/20170421201944/https://www.nzta.govt.nz/planning-and-investment/planning/planning-for-electric-vehicles/national-guidance-for-public-electric-vehicle-charging-infrastructure/charging-point-connectors/
Obsolete government recommendation from 2017:
I get you feel that impact phasing out CHAdeMO is worth it to unify public fast-charging in NZ to CCS2, but I think the impact of doing so outweighs the gains.
Should note that there are already ~25,000 CHAdeMO EV's on the roads in NZ + all the the Mitsubishi PHEV's. Phasing out CHAdeMO is sure not going to make it easier for the current (or future) owners of those vehicles. - Can't realistically mandate they be converted.
And NZ is such a small market manufacturers aren't going to build special cars for us. So Nissan NZ & Lexus NZ would likely simply pull the leaf & UX300e from our market. Mitsubishi might simply delete (or disable) fast charging abilities on their PHEV's. All up it means less choice for the consumer.
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