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MartinGZ
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  #3217330 12-Apr-2024 10:37
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What with holidays and getting covid I missed this thread.

 

I don't understand the huge, huge anger from some car drivers. I just really don't.

 

We do not have an unalienable right to drive cars unimpeded in NZ. Hell, 200 years ago there were no cars in NZ. My great grandfather was a member of the Provincial Council and as such attended meetings twice a year. Depending on conditions, it took him 2-3 days to walk the 60 miles to attend. Now we seem to get upset about a 30 second delay in traffic.

 

I'm 70 this year, got my driver's licence the day I turned 15, but had my hand-me-down bicycle many years before that. Did the big OE, and ended up cycling 8,500 km through Europe. The first 15 years of work saw me drive or cycle the 20 km to work, probably 50/50. Eventually work got in the way and at peak I was driving up to 100,000 km work mileage a year, but still managed the occasional cycle ride. One of the companies I worked for put all its high mileage drivers through a defensive driving course, and since then that is how I drive. In all that time I've probably had 4 vehicle accidents, all low-speed minor dings. These days I probably drive 15,000 km a year and cycle 3-5,000 km.

 

But what about cycling incidents. Here are a few of my more memorable ones, no major injuries except where stated.

 

     

  1. Taxi did not give way when it was coming out of a side road. Hit and broke my rear wheel.
  2. Cycling up the coast of Jugoslavia (as it was then) with a fellow cyclist when a gust of wind blew my friend right to the other side of the road, fortunately no traffic coming. We were young, fit and strong, there is nothing he could have done about it. Car drivers please remember this, it is just one of the reasons the Road Code says you should give cyclists 1.5 metres clearance when passing.
  3. Ended on the bonnet of a car that did not give way entering a roundabout. It hit my front forks and downtube. For those of you who do not know what the downtube is, it's about 50 mm in front of my leg. Phew!
  4. Side swiped by a drunken driver. I fell into the lane of traffic (dual carriage way), following cars having to take evasive action. Bad grazing and minor internal bleeding. The surface of the road was smooth hot mix, 3 week later it was given a layer of chip seal. Oh yum. Good timing.
  5. Open road, fast left hand bend, run off the road by a huge truck and trailer unit. If I hadn't exited stage left, believe me I would not be here writing this. In fairness to truck drivers, the vast majority give me plenty of room and will slow down where necessary. (I do live in the South Island 😁)
  6. Last year a car drew level with me and then proceeded to sharp turn into a supermarket carpark. I had to turn in with it, even if I had hard braked, I would have been under the back wheels. The excuse given "but I had my indicator on". Really? Would the driver have done the same if I was a motorbike or car? (Rhetorical question.) Police report got nowhere.
  7. Just yesterday, I was doing a rural ride. A car was approaching me from the other direction, another came up behind me and squeezed past about 30 cm away from my elbow, brown trouser time. See #2 above. Then another small car came up behind me and passed, crossing the centre line to give me plenty of room. Then another 3 cars approach from the opposite direction when other car comes up behind me, me thinking here we go again. But no, the driver patiently sat behind me for the 30 seconds it took for the slug of traffic to disappear. She got a friendly wave. Courteous drivers do exist, if fact they are the majority. I always acknowledge courteous driving.

 

Do I think we should have cycle lanes? Hell yeah. We are frigging vulnerable, there is no huge case of steel protecting us. Any sort of accident hurts, sometimes a lot. So slow down, give us room and be patient. It costs you nothing other than a few seconds time, to not do so could cost us our lives.




networkn
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  #3217351 12-Apr-2024 11:24
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MartinGZ:

 

Do I think we should have cycle lanes? Hell yeah. We are frigging vulnerable, there is no huge case of steel protecting us. Any sort of accident hurts, sometimes a lot. So slow down, give us room and be patient. It costs you nothing other than a few seconds time, to not do so could cost us our lives.

 

 

I agree with you on this. 

 

I also feel that cyclists need to understand how vulnerable they are, and act accordingly. Most days on the way to work I see cyclists taking wild and silly risks with the way they ride. I see it even more often with motor cylists. 

 

Everyone deserves to get home safely. In order for this to happen, ALL people need to be patient and tolerant and behave within the rules of their vehicle whatever it is, and behave in a way that is safe. I see more scooter and scooter vs bike accidents than I do Bike vs Car.

 

 


davidcole
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  #3217385 12-Apr-2024 13:34
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MartinGZ:

 

But what about cycling incidents. Here are a few of my more memorable ones, no major injuries except where stated.

 

 

I had a taxi u-turn in front of me on the Terrace - I was going down (in the middle of the lane mind you - to make sure I was seen).

 

Me and another chap were on our protected cycle way at Ngauranga/Kaiwharawhara (the foot path) - when a van decided he was going to placemakers - and just crossed the cycle way.  The other chap ended up in the side of the van.

 

 

 

 





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MikeB4
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  #3217387 12-Apr-2024 13:43
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davidcole:

 

 

 

I had a taxi u-turn in front of me on the Terrace - I was going down (in the middle of the lane mind you - to make sure I was seen).

 

Me and another chap were on our protected cycle way at Ngauranga/Kaiwharawhara (the foot path) - when a van decided he was going to placemakers - and just crossed the cycle way.  The other chap ended up in the side of the van.

 

 

 

 

 

 

We witnessed something similar when we were about to go into Spotlight last weekend. The vehicle in front of us went into the car park in the path of a cyclist I don't think the driver even looked and went into the park quite fast. Thankfully the cyclist had lightning reactions and avoided disaster.


davidcole
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  #3217388 12-Apr-2024 13:46
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MikeB4:

 

davidcole:

 

 

 

I had a taxi u-turn in front of me on the Terrace - I was going down (in the middle of the lane mind you - to make sure I was seen).

 

Me and another chap were on our protected cycle way at Ngauranga/Kaiwharawhara (the foot path) - when a van decided he was going to placemakers - and just crossed the cycle way.  The other chap ended up in the side of the van.

 

 

We witnessed something similar when we were about to go into Spotlight last weekend. The vehicle in front of us went into the car park in the path of a cyclist I don't think the driver even looked and went into the park quite fast. Thankfully the cyclist had lightning reactions and avoided disaster.

 

 

yeah,  which is a peeve on mine when I'm a pedestrian as well.  If a car is turning right into a drive, it waits for traffic.   But if a car is turning left, the pedestrian on a footpath is expected to give way.  

 

More an issue when running asyou can't stop on a dime.    And we must think of the poor car drivers having to exert a little to push a pedal down to stop.  Much better to make someone under their own power start and stop instead.   We wouldn't want them to strain something.  Poor defenceless car drivers.





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TinyTim
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  #3217422 12-Apr-2024 15:30
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networkn:

Do I think we

I also feel that cyclists need to understand how vulnerable they are, and act accordingly. Most days on the way to work I see cyclists taking wild and silly risks with the way they ride. I see it even more often with motor cylists. 


 



I normally only mountain bike now, but the last time I took my bike for a service I followed a couple of bikes the entire length of Thorndon Quay, Featherston Street and Victoria St as far as Manners St, and neither of them looked behind them once. When I'm on the road, I'm always looking over my shoulder, I want to always know what's coming and how much space I'll have when they pass. Just one example of many things cyclists can do to help keep themselves safe.




 

SCUBADOO
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  #3217427 12-Apr-2024 15:56
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davidcole:



Me and another chap were on our protected cycle way at Ngauranga/Kaiwharawhara (the foot path) - when a van decided he was going to placemakers - and just crossed the cycle way.  The other chap ended up in the side of the van.



 



I recently had almost the opposite in Ngaio, Wellington.
A cyclist keeping well left up a slight incline when I slowly and well clear overtook him in our motorhome.
A second later a thump on the left hand side and a bike on the ground visible in the side mirror.

Luckily no damage or injuries with the cyclist admitting he was powering up the hill, realised it was time to turn right into his street but we were in the way. Oops. Even cyclists should look first.

alasta
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  #3217533 12-Apr-2024 18:40
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I really feel for those of you whose hobby is putting you at risk because of the ignorant and careless behaviour of others. I have to ask, though, is it really worth it?

 

I absolutely love running and swimming and consider them to play a significant role in my quality of life. I accept a small degree of risk in those activities but if they were as risky as cycling then I honestly feel like I would probably reluctantly give them up. 


Rikkitic

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  #3217535 12-Apr-2024 18:51
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alasta:

 

I really feel for those of you whose hobby is putting you at risk because of the ignorant and careless behaviour of others. I have to ask, though, is it really worth it?

 

I absolutely love running and swimming and consider them to play a significant role in my quality of life. I accept a small degree of risk in those activities but if they were as risky as cycling then I honestly feel like I would probably reluctantly give them up. 

 

 

That is a very short-sighted way of looking at it. For one thing, cycling is much more than just a hobby for many cyclists. For another, why should anyone have to give up something they enjoy just because someone else is an idiot? Maybe drivers who can't avoid mutilating and killing other road users should not be allowed behind the wheel?

 

 





Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

 


 


davidcole
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  #3217538 12-Apr-2024 19:03
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alasta:

I really feel for those of you whose hobby is putting you at risk because of the ignorant and careless behaviour of others. I have to ask, though, is it really worth it?


I absolutely love running and swimming and consider them to play a significant role in my quality of life. I accept a small degree of risk in those activities but if they were as risky as cycling then I honestly feel like I would probably reluctantly give them up. 



Couldn’t you argue that about any sport etc?

But as also pointed out. Some use cycling as their only form on transport. Not having enough funds or trust for a vehicle or public transport.





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Shadowfoot
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  #3217569 12-Apr-2024 20:02
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TinyTim: 

I normally only mountain bike now, but the last time I took my bike for a service I followed a couple of bikes the entire length of Thorndon Quay, Featherston Street and Victoria St as far as Manners St, and neither of them looked behind them once. When I'm on the road, I'm always looking over my shoulder, I want to always know what's coming and how much space I'll have when they pass. Just one example of many things cyclists can do to help keep themselves safe.

 

I only look behind me when I'm changing direction or when I need to take the lane. I don't know what the amount of space you'll have relates to. Is it to perform evasive manoeuvres, or to stop so they can pass? Much of the streets you've named is two lanes, so drivers can easily change lanes. I wouldn't be looking behind me there. I'd be looking for anything coming from the side, including pedestrians. I can hear cars coming up behind me. I've generally only cycled those roads in peak hours, and usually deal with cars slowing me down. 





alasta
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  #3217627 13-Apr-2024 08:53
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Rikkitic:

 

For another, why should anyone have to give up something they enjoy just because someone else is an idiot? Maybe drivers who can't avoid mutilating and killing other road users should not be allowed behind the wheel?

 

 

This is one thing we agree on. 


alasta
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  #3217628 13-Apr-2024 08:55
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davidcole: 

Couldn’t you argue that about any sport etc?

 

Yes, but some sports are much riskier than others. 


  #3217634 13-Apr-2024 11:14
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davidcole:

 

yeah,  which is a peeve on mine when I'm a pedestrian as well.  If a car is turning right into a drive, it waits for traffic.   But if a car is turning left, the pedestrian on a footpath is expected to give way.  

 

 

Is this meant to be jest, I can't tell?

 

All vehicles that are entering or exiting private property via a driveway are required to give way to pedestrians.

 

https://www.nzta.govt.nz/roadcode/general-road-code/about-other-road-users/sharing-the-road/sharing-the-road-with-pedestrians/

 

"When you drive across a footpath, such as going in and out of a driveway or supermarket carpark, you must give way to people using the footpath."


TinyTim
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  #3217687 13-Apr-2024 12:36
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Shadowfoot:

 

TinyTim: 

I normally only mountain bike now, but the last time I took my bike for a service I followed a couple of bikes the entire length of Thorndon Quay, Featherston Street and Victoria St as far as Manners St, and neither of them looked behind them once. When I'm on the road, I'm always looking over my shoulder, I want to always know what's coming and how much space I'll have when they pass. Just one example of many things cyclists can do to help keep themselves safe.

 

I only look behind me when I'm changing direction or when I need to take the lane. I don't know what the amount of space you'll have relates to. Is it to perform evasive manoeuvres, or to stop so they can pass? Much of the streets you've named is two lanes, so drivers can easily change lanes. I wouldn't be looking behind me there. I'd be looking for anything coming from the side, including pedestrians. I can hear cars coming up behind me. I've generally only cycled those roads in peak hours, and usually deal with cars slowing me down. 

 

 

I guess if the clearway is clear and you've got loads of room then that's ok. But if you're passing parked cars, taxis, couriers, curb extensions etc and there's less room it's good to know what your options are if you have to swerve for a door, someone pulling out, pothole, etc. 





 

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