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Aaroona

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#302300 13-Nov-2022 17:41
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I am considering replacing my ICE vehicle where I am used to getting around 500-700km per tank. However the apartment I currently live in (and I wouldn't bank on the next place having it either) does not have the ability to charge at home.

 

I have a few questions...

 

  • How has your charging experience been moving from ICE?
  • Any gotchas you wish you knew and would pass on to a would be EV buyer?
  • what has been a common pain point, or something that surprised you?
  • For those that don't have a Tesla - how do you find route setting and ability to find charge stops? 

 

 

I do most of my driving around Auckland - I've been eyeing up a BMW i4 or a Tesla Model 3, unsure which yet, but the BMW was an excellent drive. I currently have a BMW, so naturally was fairly happy with the build quality and materials, very familiar. 

 

I would be doing a few long distance road trips (500+km trips) now and then too.


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Dingbatt
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  #2995602 13-Nov-2022 18:50
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While I recognise this question is addressed to EV owners without home charging, as a Model 3 owner I would make the following comments.

 

Free chargers are always being used. For some people, EV charging etiquette doesn’t seem to matter at free chargers.

 

Now that Chargenet have increased their tariffs, an i4 (@200Wh/km) will cost you 16c per km, plus whatever future RUCs are imposed. Having said that, if you have the readies for an i4, you aren’t buying to save money.

 

Think about how you will fit charging into your routine. How long does it take you to do your 500-700km per tank? Can you take your car to a fast charger and go and do something else? Take a note of how busy the chargers are around you.

 

Battery management systems are sophisticated and will protect it during charging, physics (chemistry?) means repeated fast charging will affect battery life more than trickle charging.

 

As an aside. The Model 3 and i4 are not in the same class (imo). The M3 is a $40K car with a $30K battery. The i4 is a $80K car with a $30K battery (add $30K for both M3P and i4M50). If you like your BMW, you may be a bit disappointed by the M3.





“We’ve arranged a society based on science and technology, in which nobody understands anything about science technology. Carl Sagan 1996




RunningMan
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  #2995604 13-Nov-2022 18:52
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billgates
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  #2995609 13-Nov-2022 19:16
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You could look at switching to Genesis EV plan for your home and they have a free add on to their EV plan which allows you to charge your car at ChargeNet locations and pay the same kW rate as your home Genesis plan. 9pm to 7am is very cheap on the EV plan so if you fancy even cheaper charging rates at ChargeNet then rock up to their location at 9pm which I assume would also be quieter and you will likely find a spare slot. 

 

BMW and Tesla are miles apart. BMW is a much better quality build with a lot more features but you also pay for it. Ventilated seats is missing from Model 3 which is a big deal in summer IMO. The infotainment and dashboard on the BMW is miles ahead of the model 3. The turn by turn directions using front camera displaying on the infotainment is a great feature on the BMW. 

Have you also considered PHEV? The like of Lexus NX 450+ for same price as i4 Sedan is an amazing SUV and it has 75KM of EV range but on hybrid it will get you 3.5l/100KM average. Wait times at charging location will be much shorter with PHEV. You can also look at BMW IX1 Electric which will launch in NZ in March 2023 but can book now. Should be just under $100k. 





Do whatever you want to do man.

  



vexxxboy
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  #2995645 13-Nov-2022 21:15
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and dont forget what happens if you havent a driveway or garage, which in Auckland is a normal thing with high density housing.

 

 

 

https://www.stuff.co.nz/life-style/homed/houses/300652056/the-struggle-of-charging-your-ev-when-your-house-has-no-driveway





Common sense is not as common as you think.


mudguard
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  #2995648 13-Nov-2022 21:22
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vexxxboy:

and dont forget what happens if you havent a driveway or garage, which in Auckland is a normal thing with high density housing.


 


https://www.stuff.co.nz/life-style/homed/houses/300652056/the-struggle-of-charging-your-ev-when-your-house-has-no-driveway



That person does have a garage! How the Mini doesn't fit is beyond me.

Scott3
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  #2995660 13-Nov-2022 22:18
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My take is don't do it (unless you have charging at work). This coming from somebody with an EV in the driveway.

In my mind, we are still at the early adopter stage with EV's, and the convenience and low cost of home charging is pretty much essential to offset the limitations of EV ownership (higher purchase price, shorter range than petrol cars). Setting out each morning with a charged (and preheated in winter) car is one of the major perks of EV ownership in my mind.

My car is a 24kWh leaf with about a 100km range. Weekdays I charge 80%, and weekends 100% (unless I know we won't be doing much driving). Range is so short charging every night is quite important.

Even with a modern long range EV, without home charging, you will be committing a lot of your time to public charging.

 

Need some star's to align to not make this super painful. One example of how it could work is if your preferred supermarket has a fast charger in the carpark (quite a few do), and you do a regular supermaket shop once a week, and you can leave the car charging while you shop. (If you get 90% of rated range in the real world, you want a minimum of a 100km buffer and charge to 80%, that means a 591km rated range car like the BMW i4 would be good for 325km / week of running). Could double that by shopping twice a weak, or do a boost at any fast charger if getting low.

 

Some things to consider / be aware of:

 

  • The free vector charges in Auckland are extremely contested. Count on waiting in a queue. Also they have a 30min limit, and being 50kW units, the most power you could get in half an hour is 25kWh (real world would be a little less). Less than 1/3rd of a charge of a car with a 81kWh usable battery like the i4. If there are people waiting, you will be expected to strictly adhere to the time limit (and there is a time counter on the charger screen for all to see).
  • Most of the fast charges in metro Auckland are 50kW only, so you would take basically an hour to replace the the 325km a week of example running. Could time well with a supermarket shop, but a long time to just wait. (there are three faster non-tesla charges in urban Auckland, but two of them are in industrial area's). - Paid chargers don't typically have a time limit.
  • There is some congestion at paid chargers. If you turn up to Eastridge New world, and the charger is occupied, you would need to wait for it if you want to charge while you shop.
  • The common veefill 50kW chargers have two cords (one of each type), but can only charge one car at a time. Rarer chargers like the 75kW one at the Z on beach road in the CBD can do two cars at at time, if they each have different plug types.
  • Paid DC fast charging isn't cheap. Charge.net's new rates for the like of that new world charger is 80c/kWh (for comparison my home power is 17c/kWh). At 17.2kWh/100km, this works out to $13.75/100km. For comparison a camry hybrid at 5L/100km using $2.4/L petrol would cost about $12/100km to fuel. And EV's could have RUC's applied in a couple of years.
  • Currently EV take-up is outstripping the construction of DC chargers, so congestion will get worse.
  • With vector's Auckland chargers being free, there is little incentive for commercial companies to build out chargers nearby, so it could be a while until urban Auckland gets a charge.net hyper charger (2x 300kW chargers, each capable of sharing power over three cords)
  • Road trips in something like an i4 are unlikely to give issue. Chargenet hyperchargers in Kaiwaka, Taupo & Rotorua give good reach from Auckland.
  • Charge curves. - EV's fast charge slower as you approach 80%, so generally EV owners try to avoid charging above 80% of fast chargers. Example curves below. i4 is fairly unusual in that it can keep charging at around 50kW until about 95%.

i4 Charge curve:

 

 

 

 

EV6 LR RWD charge curve:

 

 

Model 3 LR AWD Charge curve:

 

external_image

 

 

 

 

 

I would recommend picking out your Toyota / Lexus (non plug-in) hybrid of choice and going that route (there is a 2020 GS450h on TradeMe that looks extremely nice, and would have a range of around 1000km)

 

I advise against going for a plug in hybrid. These are even more dependent on home/work charging to stack up. Short range's would mean you need to visit public charging most days to take advantage of the plug in bit.

 

 

 

Might be worth having a bit of a crack at the body corp regarding charging at your apartment building. Either by running a cable down the riser from your apartment's metered supply, or from the common car-park power supply (with some kind of meter so you can pay the cost of that power). Every apartment building is going to need to work out a solution for EV charging over the next decade or so, and there may well be other occupants that have an EV in their future plans. Somebody needs to kick off such a matter (but if you plan to move soon, you might not be the right person). Long term the ability to add EV charging to carparks will add substantial value to them.

 

Should note that while higher current, say 32A single phase (7.2kW) charging is desirable - It enables you to do say a 500km day trip on Saturday, plug in overnight, and repeat on Sunday, it is not really essential. A standard domestic socket will add about 10km range / hour, so around 100km overnight. Plenty to cover most people's daily running, and they can rely on public fast chargers if they ever want to do back to back giant day trips.

 

 


Scott3
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  #2995663 13-Nov-2022 22:22
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mudguard:
vexxxboy:

 

and dont forget what happens if you havent a driveway or garage, which in Auckland is a normal thing with high density housing.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

https://www.stuff.co.nz/life-style/homed/houses/300652056/the-struggle-of-charging-your-ev-when-your-house-has-no-driveway

 



That person does have a garage! How the Mini doesn't fit is beyond me.

 

I assume that it is being used for a purpose other than car parking (perhaps storage, or a home gym).

 

Weird choice of headline given the house was built with off-street parking.


 
 
 

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Batman
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  #2995687 14-Nov-2022 06:48
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billgates:

Have you also considered PHEV? The like of Lexus NX 450+ for same price as i4 Sedan is an amazing SUV and it has 75KM of EV range but on hybrid it will get you 3.5l/100KM average. Wait times at charging location will be much shorter with PHEV. You can also look at BMW IX1 Electric which will launch in NZ in March 2023 but can book now. Should be just under $100k. 

 

 

what's the point of PHEV if there's no home charger? a self charging hybrid would be a different story


RunningMan
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  #2995691 14-Nov-2022 07:29
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Batman:a self charging hybrid would be a different story

 

A self charging hybrid is nothing but marketing bait. It's an ICE powered vehicle, albeit more efficent for stop-start driving.


Dingbatt
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  #2995693 14-Nov-2022 07:40
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And yet you knew exactly what was being referenced.

 

 

 

In the OP’s case it may be the best option if there is no ability to plug in at home. If they really like BMWs then a 330e may suit and plug in when you can otherwise run it as a “self charging” hybrid.





“We’ve arranged a society based on science and technology, in which nobody understands anything about science technology. Carl Sagan 1996


lchiu7
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  #2995695 14-Nov-2022 07:51
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billgates:

 

You could look at switching to Genesis EV plan for your home and they have a free add on to their EV plan which allows you to charge your car at ChargeNet locations and pay the same kW rate as your home Genesis plan. 9pm to 7am is very cheap on the EV plan so if you fancy even cheaper charging rates at ChargeNet then rock up to their location at 9pm which I assume would also be quieter and you will likely find a spare slot. 

 

 

 

 

I could not find that plan on the Genesis web site as that is interesting to me. I don't live in Auckland but I am debating if I should install a home charger or just use the standard wall outlet and drive to a bank of Chargenet chargers when I want a faster charge. 


dklong
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  #2995697 14-Nov-2022 07:56
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I spent about 8 weeks relying on public charging while waiting for a sparkie to do some work.
2 factors to consider.
1. Can my car do a whole week on one charge - both of your options should be able to easily unless you have a wild commute.
2. Is there a 50kW or better public charger somewhere near by, preferably somewhere you want to go. We have a couple in the local New World Carpark and there is also a nice cafe and a restaurant we frequent other side of the Carpark. So each weekend I would either top up again while I did the weekly shop or while I had Sunday brunch. Not exactly painful. Home charging is obviously even easier but this worked fine.
If you don’t have the latter it might not work very well.
Good luck. 😁

billgates
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  #2995698 14-Nov-2022 08:02
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Batman:

 

what's the point of PHEV if there's no home charger? a self charging hybrid would be a different story

 

 

PHEV has a smaller battery which will not take as long and waste OP's time at public charging station as a full-size EV. The Lexus can provide 75KM of EV range which for a lot of commuters is more than enough to and back from work. Hybrid vehicles are useless when it comes to pickup power on hills and overtaking other cars. This is where ICE, PHEV and EV shine. Hybrid is perfect for a taxi or for folks that do not need pickup power. I imagine if the OP has $110K to spend they want the pickup power... 





Do whatever you want to do man.

  

billgates
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  #2995699 14-Nov-2022 08:04
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lchiu7:

 

I could not find that plan on the Genesis web site as that is interesting to me. I don't live in Auckland but I am debating if I should install a home charger or just use the standard wall outlet and drive to a bank of Chargenet chargers when I want a faster charge. 

 

 

 

 

You will need to call Genesis to get the pricing for EV plan for your region. 

 

Electric vehicles and electric cars in NZ | Genesis NZ (genesisenergy.co.nz)





Do whatever you want to do man.

  

lchiu7
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  #2995705 14-Nov-2022 08:23
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billgates:

 

lchiu7:

 

I could not find that plan on the Genesis web site as that is interesting to me. I don't live in Auckland but I am debating if I should install a home charger or just use the standard wall outlet and drive to a bank of Chargenet chargers when I want a faster charge. 

 

 

 

 

You will need to call Genesis to get the pricing for EV plan for your region. 

 

Electric vehicles and electric cars in NZ | Genesis NZ (genesisenergy.co.nz)

 

 

 

 

Just called them and they are sending me a quote. The Chargenet plan is I would pay the lower of whatever Chargenet charges versus what Genesis would charge. Not sure if that is  an apples to apples comparison since I don't have a fast charger at home.


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