Paul1977:

 

The cleverest one I've heard recently is Trumpelthinskin.

 

Rikkitic:

 

There is another title for the president. It is commander-in-chief. The president commands the military. His powers are limited by Congress, and there is a requirement that military personnel should disobey illegal orders, but who is to say what could happen in the right ('wrong') circumstances?

 

The world is not the same place it was in the 1930s but that does not mean we should ignore the lessons of history. I do not believe it is an overreaction to look at what happened then and to place that in a modern context. I fervently hope US democracy is strong enough to survive someone like Trump. Perhaps it is. But it would be foolish to just look on passively and hope for the best without doing everything possible to resist Trump's machinations. He has repeatedly demonstrated contempt for, and ignorance of, democratic institutions and traditions. His mass gatherings and attacks on the press are blatant attempts to circumvent those institutions and traditions by appealing directly to the mob instincts of his supporters. Anyone who does not find this very alarming is being foolish. 

 

 

 

 

 

The US Army oath ....

"I, _____, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God."

I can assure you military take the oaths of office very seriously.

The Presidential Oath...

"I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the Office ofPresident of the United States, and will to the best of my ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States."

As you can see both are sworn to protect the constitution and the US from out and from in.

"The markets" are ecstatic because Trump will deregulate, removing/revoking consumer protection, environmental protection, prudential controls.

Fascism doesn't need an apocalypse. 

The tangerine tyrant is a bit more ominous than "populist" - he's also strongly authoritarian, and the rallying cry against his detractors is indeed that they're "liberals" which is now a dirty word in the lexicon of the stupid masses who elected him.

You two are being tricked by his buffoonery into thinking he's a harmless fool. 

If you think that details like the ungodly sight of Melania reciting the Lord's Prayer at Trump's mini Nuremberg rally was "just an innocent nod to widely held christian values", then I'd urge you to think harder about why that happened and who the intended audience was.  Hint - it wasn't to preach to the converted.

MikeB4:

 

The South China sea, that is pure posturing, both sides will appear publicly to be standing firm but concessions will be won and given in private by both sides and life will move on. Neither will risk mutual destruction over a few rocks. The One China stance will remain and that posturing is over. The Mexico wall, there is a fence there now and it will be enhanced and Trump  will call it a wall despite what photos will show. The middle east /ISIS actions will continue with the US and Russia upping their engagements and possibly deploy land assets.

 

As for the US economy, if Trump honours his promise and rebuild the infrastructure the US economy will boom however that type of GDP lift is not sustainable and is largely illusionary. 

 

All your arguments make sense. But everything that has happened since Trump first announced has been pretty much the opposite of what one would rationally expect to happen.

When it comes to Trump, the logical outcome doesn't seem to apply so I am taking nothing for granted.

Rikkitic:

 

There is another title for the president. It is commander-in-chief. The president commands the military. His powers are limited by Congress, and there is a requirement that military personnel should disobey illegal orders, but who is to say what could happen in the right ('wrong') circumstances?

 

The world is not the same place it was in the 1930s but that does not mean we should ignore the lessons of history. I do not believe it is an overreaction to look at what happened then and to place that in a modern context. I fervently hope US democracy is strong enough to survive someone like Trump. Perhaps it is. But it would be foolish to just look on passively and hope for the best without doing everything possible to resist Trump's machinations. He has repeatedly demonstrated contempt for, and ignorance of, democratic institutions and traditions. His mass gatherings and attacks on the press are blatant attempts to circumvent those institutions and traditions by appealing directly to the mob instincts of his supporters. Anyone who does not find this very alarming is being foolish. 

 

 

I dont find this very alarming so I guess I am a fool. Or, those that find it very alarming are over reacting. We don't know yet what will transpire, but to date, from his campaign to right now its all bluster. The ban issue was a real time action from him, granted. Quickly kicked to touch.

I'd like to hear what some think will happen to the key points I listed above. That is what is important. His BS rants are not important, they just add to discontent towards him. (Which in itself, is a very good thing)

Lets translate the anger and name calling etc to real world issues. Its about what he does not what he says. We are all used to him, so when he rants, its sad, but expected. That is really his problem not ours. Ours is what he does. And so far thats pretty much zero.

Paul1977:

 

MikeB4:

 

The South China sea, that is pure posturing, both sides will appear publicly to be standing firm but concessions will be won and given in private by both sides and life will move on. Neither will risk mutual destruction over a few rocks. The One China stance will remain and that posturing is over. The Mexico wall, there is a fence there now and it will be enhanced and Trump  will call it a wall despite what photos will show. The middle east /ISIS actions will continue with the US and Russia upping their engagements and possibly deploy land assets.

 

As for the US economy, if Trump honours his promise and rebuild the infrastructure the US economy will boom however that type of GDP lift is not sustainable and is largely illusionary. 

 

 

All your arguments make sense. But everything that has happened since Trump first announced has been pretty much the opposite of what one would rationally expect to happen.

 

When it comes to Trump, the logical outcome doesn't seem to apply so I am taking nothing for granted.

 

Fair points, he is different. But he is not doing anything, despite that his policy rants were all about doing everything. 

tdgeek:

 

Fair points, he is different. But he is not doing anything, despite that his policy rants were all about doing everything. 

 

It's also only been 4 weeks.

Fred99:

 

"The markets" are ecstatic because Trump will deregulate, removing/revoking consumer protection, environmental protection, prudential controls.

 

Fascism doesn't need an apocalypse. 

 

The tangerine tyrant is a bit more ominous than "populist" - he's also strongly authoritarian, and the rallying cry against his detractors is indeed that they're "liberals" which is now a dirty word in the lexicon of the stupid masses who elected him.

 

You two are being tricked by his buffoonery into thinking he's a harmless fool. 

 

If you think that details like the ungodly sight of Melania reciting the Lord's Prayer at Trump's mini Nuremberg rally was "just an innocent nod to widely held christian values", then I'd urge you to think harder about why that happened and who the intended audience was.  Hint - it wasn't to preach to the converted.

 

I am not being tricked by anyone, thanks.

Fred99:

 

"The markets" are ecstatic because Trump will deregulate, removing/revoking consumer protection, environmental protection, prudential controls.

 

Fascism doesn't need an apocalypse. 

 

The tangerine tyrant is a bit more ominous than "populist" - he's also strongly authoritarian, and the rallying cry against his detractors is indeed that they're "liberals" which is now a dirty word in the lexicon of the stupid masses who elected him.

 

You two are being tricked by his buffoonery into thinking he's a harmless fool. 

 

If you think that details like the ungodly sight of Melania reciting the Lord's Prayer at Trump's mini Nuremberg rally was "just an innocent nod to widely held christian values", then I'd urge you to think harder about why that happened and who the intended audience was.  Hint - it wasn't to preach to the converted.

 

Still waiting. All I hear in the news is his rants, still waiting The wall, international trade. bringing jobs and companies back to the US and so on. Still waiting. Hardly a murmur on anything except his rants.

Buffoonery, correct. So far the only harmful thing is the ban, thats been wiped. His rants and talk isnt accomplishing anything. Im yet to see any of his Ill fix it, I can fix everything promises get into news discusisons. Its only about his buffonery. He is a fool. And so far he is harmless, except to himself and his country. 

How long will it take before he starts doing things that fall into the crisis mode?  Another month? 6 Months. Its drying up before it got started

Paul1977:

 

MikeB4:

 

The South China sea, that is pure posturing, both sides will appear publicly to be standing firm but concessions will be won and given in private by both sides and life will move on. Neither will risk mutual destruction over a few rocks. The One China stance will remain and that posturing is over. The Mexico wall, there is a fence there now and it will be enhanced and Trump  will call it a wall despite what photos will show. The middle east /ISIS actions will continue with the US and Russia upping their engagements and possibly deploy land assets.

 

As for the US economy, if Trump honours his promise and rebuild the infrastructure the US economy will boom however that type of GDP lift is not sustainable and is largely illusionary. 

 

 

All your arguments make sense. But everything that has happened since Trump first announced has been pretty much the opposite of what one would rationally expect to happen.

 

When it comes to Trump, the logical outcome doesn't seem to apply so I am taking nothing for granted.

 

When it comes to foreign policy etc  Trump up against some very canny leaders, for example Xi Jingping did not come down in the last shower.

MikeB4:

 

Fred99:

 

"The markets" are ecstatic because Trump will deregulate, removing/revoking consumer protection, environmental protection, prudential controls.

 

Fascism doesn't need an apocalypse. 

 

The tangerine tyrant is a bit more ominous than "populist" - he's also strongly authoritarian, and the rallying cry against his detractors is indeed that they're "liberals" which is now a dirty word in the lexicon of the stupid masses who elected him.

 

You two are being tricked by his buffoonery into thinking he's a harmless fool. 

 

If you think that details like the ungodly sight of Melania reciting the Lord's Prayer at Trump's mini Nuremberg rally was "just an innocent nod to widely held christian values", then I'd urge you to think harder about why that happened and who the intended audience was.  Hint - it wasn't to preach to the converted.

 

 

 

 

I am not being tricked by anyone, thanks.

 

I disagree.  You two have been consistent apologists for Trump for this entire thread.

Such as your suggestion that Trump is a mere "populist".

Fred99:

 

MikeB4:

 

Fred99:

 

"The markets" are ecstatic because Trump will deregulate, removing/revoking consumer protection, environmental protection, prudential controls.

 

Fascism doesn't need an apocalypse. 

 

The tangerine tyrant is a bit more ominous than "populist" - he's also strongly authoritarian, and the rallying cry against his detractors is indeed that they're "liberals" which is now a dirty word in the lexicon of the stupid masses who elected him.

 

You two are being tricked by his buffoonery into thinking he's a harmless fool. 

 

If you think that details like the ungodly sight of Melania reciting the Lord's Prayer at Trump's mini Nuremberg rally was "just an innocent nod to widely held christian values", then I'd urge you to think harder about why that happened and who the intended audience was.  Hint - it wasn't to preach to the converted.

 

 

 

 

I am not being tricked by anyone, thanks.

 

 

I disagree.  You two have been consistent apologists for Trump for this entire thread.

 

Such as your suggestion that Trump is a mere "populist".

 

 

 

Stop the Ad homonyms, Don't attack the person attack the argument thanks 

The Trump style is more inline with Populism, now of course that may change but that does not mean it will morph into Fascism. The two can exhibit some characteristics of each other.

When Trump goes - which will be when Bannon determines it to be the right time - then look who the USA has as leader, and the administration supporting him.

A fundamentalist Christian leader with a chief strategist who's on record for advocating “enlightened capitalism of the Judeo-Christian West”, based on the “underlying spiritual and moral foundations of Christianity” because creeping secularism has “sapped the strength of the Judeo-Christian West to defend its ideals.”

I find the naivety of some of these comments simply stunning. You people seriously think Trump's rallies and attacks on the media are nothing to worry about? It will all be alright, Jack? He is already doing things that fall into crisis mode. It is incremental. It doesn't suddenly go boom. A tyrant undermines trust in the free press a little at a time until there is no-one left to criticise him that anyone listens to. This is what Putin did. Why do you blithely assume it can't happen in America? And it is not about foreign policy, it is about domestic policy. Even Trump is unlikely to go to war with the Chinese, and Xi Jingping could care less what he does inside the USA.

We just had a series of bad fires around the country. The way to fight fire is to be prepared, not to just assume it won't happen. That seems pretty basic to me.