Importing cleaner cars discounts to New Zealand in December 2021.

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Ultimate Geek

#2280915 21-Jul-2019 18:09

tdgeek:

Thats amazing. I calculated my 656cc motorbike economy years ago, I think it was about 3.5L / 100Km 4 around town. Thats a bike wth less than half the engine cc and that weighs just 219kg wet.

Yes, it really is pretty remarkable. Some people have posted photos of the fuel their consumption readout lower than 2.5L/100Km, however I've never been able to achieve that around town. I suspect they're driving downhill for a fair proportion of the way!

This is one of the reasons why I think the decision to subsidise hybrids is the right move; it's a quick way to provide a substantial reduction in emissions, excellent driving range, and there are a large number of more affordable models available.

The big issue around adoption has been the additional cost. In the Fit's case, it might cost $4K more (say) compared to the equivalent non-hybrid model, but if you can reduce that via a subsidy it would be enough to swing a decision towards that vehicle. For those that do a large number of Km, then savings in fuel alone already create a sound business case. Preaching to the converted I know.

tdgeek

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#2280918 21-Jul-2019 18:27

wsnz:

tdgeek:

Thats amazing. I calculated my 656cc motorbike economy years ago, I think it was about 3.5L / 100Km 4 around town. Thats a bike wth less than half the engine cc and that weighs just 219kg wet.

Yes, it really is pretty remarkable. Some people have posted photos of the fuel their consumption readout lower than 2.5L/100Km, however I've never been able to achieve that around town. I suspect they're driving downhill for a fair proportion of the way!

This is one of the reasons why I think the decision to subsidise hybrids is the right move; it's a quick way to provide a substantial reduction in emissions, excellent driving range, and there are a large number of more affordable models available.

The big issue around adoption has been the additional cost. In the Fit's case, it might cost $4K more (say) compared to the equivalent non-hybrid model, but if you can reduce that via a subsidy it would be enough to swing a decision towards that vehicle. For those that do a large number of Km, then savings in fuel alone already create a sound business case. Preaching to the converted I know.

100%

I favour pure EV, despite what some protaganists here think. Right now, they are too expensive and do not offer a fuel savings advantage. 50% that's all. Stuff today had an article, also wrong. Now it's gone.But it said that EV is the way to go, but not now. I agree. It also incorrectly mentioned the cost per litre equivalent is 30c. Wrong. Its 30c plus RUC so make that a dollar

frednz

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#2283814 26-Jul-2019 07:27

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12252524

The above is a link to an article by Bryce Edwards titled: "Greens' sneer politics an unfortunate feature of our times".

From the above:

The Green Party has been quick to apologise and delete their attack advertisement mocking National leader Simon Bridges, not only for his environmental policies, but also for his accent. But what led the party to make such an ad in the first place? The ad is an example of the global phenomenon of "sneer politics", in which it's fashionable for liberal elites to admonish and ridicule the ordinariness and 'uncouth' elements of political opponents.

Mr Bridges himself has been seen as a "good sport" in not complaining about the video attack on him. What else could he do? He may even welcome further attacks on his accent - it's possible he would benefit from this.

For the political left to take on their opponents more successfully, they need to get away from the current urge to denigrate their opponents - this has proved to be a dead-end everywhere. Instead the focus has to be on defeating their actual ideas, and on fostering a focus on progressive solutions to the issues of the day.

tdgeek

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#2283817 26-Jul-2019 07:33

frednz:

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12252524

The above is a link to an article by Bryce Edwards titled: "Greens' sneer politics an unfortunate feature of our times".

From the above:

The Green Party has been quick to apologise and delete their attack advertisement mocking National leader Simon Bridges, not only for his environmental policies, but also for his accent. But what led the party to make such an ad in the first place? The ad is an example of the global phenomenon of "sneer politics", in which it's fashionable for liberal elites to admonish and ridicule the ordinariness and 'uncouth' elements of political opponents.

Mr Bridges himself has been seen as a "good sport" in not complaining about the video attack on him. What else could he do? He may even welcome further attacks on his accent - it's possible he would benefit from this.

For the political left to take on their opponents more successfully, they need to get away from the current urge to denigrate their opponents - this has proved to be a dead-end everywhere. Instead the focus has to be on defeating their actual ideas, and on fostering a focus on progressive solutions to the issues of the day.

I fully agree, but it works both ways, always has. The greens need to focus on green or get out, they dont do politics very well

GV27

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#2283826 26-Jul-2019 08:01

tdgeek:

I fully agree, but it works both ways, always has. The greens need to focus on green or get out, they dont do politics very well

I see stuff like what they did as a struggle to adapt from an 'opposition at all costs' attitude designed to energise an activist base to actually functioning as part of the Government and defending policies that they've lobbied for.

Some of the criticism around their MPs makes a lot more sense when looked from this angle instead of the default 'people criticising them are just racist' card that seems to get played a lot.

Obraik

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#2284237 26-Jul-2019 14:07

frednz:

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12252524

The above is a link to an article by Bryce Edwards titled: "Greens' sneer politics an unfortunate feature of our times".

From the above:

The Green Party has been quick to apologise and delete their attack advertisement mocking National leader Simon Bridges, not only for his environmental policies, but also for his accent. But what led the party to make such an ad in the first place? The ad is an example of the global phenomenon of "sneer politics", in which it's fashionable for liberal elites to admonish and ridicule the ordinariness and 'uncouth' elements of political opponents.

Mr Bridges himself has been seen as a "good sport" in not complaining about the video attack on him. What else could he do? He may even welcome further attacks on his accent - it's possible he would benefit from this.

For the political left to take on their opponents more successfully, they need to get away from the current urge to denigrate their opponents - this has proved to be a dead-end everywhere. Instead the focus has to be on defeating their actual ideas, and on fostering a focus on progressive solutions to the issues of the day.

I appreciate that the video was made though...I had a good laugh at it!

Looking to buy a Tesla? Use my referral link and we both get credits

kingdragonfly

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#2289291 3-Aug-2019 18:57

https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-zealand/slim-majority-support-electric-vehicle-discount-and-high-emitter-fee

Slim majority support electric vehicle discount and high emitter fee

TV NZ One

Fifty-one per cent of New Zealanders support the Government's proposed electric vehicle scheme that would see low-emission cars subsidised and a fee added to some high emitters.

The latest 1 NEWS Colmar Brunton Poll found 51 per cent were in support, 39 per cent opposed it and 10 per cent did not know.

The groups of people who were more likely than average to support the scheme were Green Party supporters, Wellingtonians, Labour supporters, Asian New Zealanders and people aged 18-34.

Those who were more than likely against were National supporters, people living in Waikato, men aged 35 and over and New Zealand Europeans.

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GV27

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#2289355 3-Aug-2019 21:56

Almost all of the urban vox pops were from Wellingtonians

frednz

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#2290830 6-Aug-2019 11:37

https://thedailyblog.co.nz/2019/08/05/who-the-national-party-are-really-defending-in-their-war-against-electric-cars/

From the above:

The Government have put forward a clever policy of subsidising electric cars by hitting up gas guzzlers with higher prices.

To date, the National Party, (who are climate deniers and who represent climate denier voters as well as the polluters), have attempted to sell their war on electric cars as defending the poor working class tradies of NZ.

That’s bull****.

Well, I guess it's just "click bait", but I can't help wondering why there are so many attacks on the National Party, just because they don't favour the feebate scheme, under which the Government proposes that some petrol vehicles are going to be taxed to help pay for the discounts on so-called low emitting vehicles.

The National Party makes a valid point, some people would pay more to buy petrol vehicles, and this is definitely yet another new tax.

This comment on the article is of interest:

Sad to see Labour’s energy policy being steered by the scientifically illiterate Greens. Bear with me for a second and I’ll explain:

In NZ electricity generation is about 82% renewable (depending on the year) thanks to our big hydro schemes, geothermal and a bit of wind power. The remainder has to be topped up by burning coal at Huntly.

So if I buy a new imported electric car, where is that additional power coming from to charge it?
Yes folks! That additional electrical demand I have created has to be provided by burning a bit more coal at Huntly. All those Grey Lynn hippies with their Nissan Leafs and who vote Green are do more harm to the environment than the ‘rich pricks’ with their diesel 4x4s.

tdgeek

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#2290843 6-Aug-2019 11:52

frednz:

https://thedailyblog.co.nz/2019/08/05/who-the-national-party-are-really-defending-in-their-war-against-electric-cars/

From the above:

The Government have put forward a clever policy of subsidising electric cars by hitting up gas guzzlers with higher prices.

To date, the National Party, (who are climate deniers and who represent climate denier voters as well as the polluters), have attempted to sell their war on electric cars as defending the poor working class tradies of NZ.

That’s bull****.

Well, I guess it's just "click bait", but I can't help wondering why there are so many attacks on the National Party, just because they don't favour the feebate scheme, under which the Government proposes that some petrol vehicles are going to be taxed to help pay for the discounts on so-called low emitting vehicles.

The National Party makes a valid point, some people would pay more to buy petrol vehicles, and this is definitely yet another new tax.

This comment on the article is of interest:

Sad to see Labour’s energy policy being steered by the scientifically illiterate Greens. Bear with me for a second and I’ll explain:

In NZ electricity generation is about 82% renewable (depending on the year) thanks to our big hydro schemes, geothermal and a bit of wind power. The remainder has to be topped up by burning coal at Huntly.

So if I buy a new imported electric car, where is that additional power coming from to charge it?
Yes folks! That additional electrical demand I have created has to be provided by burning a bit more coal at Huntly. All those Grey Lynn hippies with their Nissan Leafs and who vote Green are do more harm to the environment than the ‘rich pricks’ with their diesel 4x4s.

I though you want a feeble type scheme? IMO National isn't that green, but they know they have to be, so they will be. They also need to oppose. They may bee 100% in support of this feeble thing but they still have to say its not the way to go. They need to formulate thier version. They haven't, as the feebate pan is more or less ok, and its been adopted everywhere else.

Its not a tax. A tax is revenue. This "tax" is diverted to the EV community. Its a driver, a guide, a means to promote purchases of EV's and reduce sales of ICE. Its a financial means to an end, and that end is not the Consolidated Fund. Although Simon actually said or inferred it was as it will generate more fees than subsides when it starts. Off course it will, Maths 101 Off course, unless they stop and start the subsidy so it matched the penalty in any given period, obviously there will be a mismatch. At any given period.

SaltyNZ

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#2290850 6-Aug-2019 11:56

1. Martyn Bradbury sounds like a bit of a DH

2. The attacks on the National Party are not just because they don't favour a feebate scheme, they are because they don't favour anything which might irritate their core voters, who are much more likely to be climate change deniers / don't really give a crap one way or the other because they're rich enough to avoid the consequences than otherwise. It's hard to say how much of the real Simon Bridges or Judith Collins there is inside the public versions but either way it doesn't really matter because the public versions are not interested in tackling climate change in any meaningful way, and the public versions are the ones that make the policy decisions

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These comments are my own and do not represent the opinions of 2degrees.

wellygary

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#2290858 6-Aug-2019 12:10

SaltyNZ:

It's hard to say how much of the real Simon Bridges or Judith Collins there is inside the public versions but either way it doesn't really matter because the public versions are not interested in tackling climate change in any meaningful way, and the public versions are the ones that make the policy decisions

Bridges has 2 PHEVS, so he's not a raving EV hater....

"Transport Minister Simon Bridges has made the switch to an electric car, saying they are not just for "new age tofu eaters".Bridges recently purchased two plug-in hybrid vehicles - a Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV for himself and an Audi e-Tron for his wife Natalie. His last car was a diesel-powered Hyundai Santa Fe.

"Now that I've done it I wouldn't go back," Bridges said. "To the non-believers out there, I'd say try one."

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11770445

frednz

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#2290859 6-Aug-2019 12:11

Seen on FB:

Stop The Car Tax

Labour’s Car Tax will increase the price of some of New Zealand’s most popular vehicles by up to $3000.

If it is introduced alongside a proposed emissions tax on importers then it could hike the price of some vehicles by more than $6000.

This policy will hurt New Zealanders, particularly those who don’t have low-emission vehicle options that fit their lifestyles – farmers, tradespeople and low-income earners for whom these vehicles will still be too expensive.

It’s not right that families with three kids will have to pay thousands more for a used seven-seater van so that wealthy executives can buy a cheaper Tesla Model 3 or a BMW i3.

The Associate Minister of Transport Julie Anne Genter even described the Car Tax as just a "small fee".

Would Kiwis agree up to $6000 is just a "small fee"?

The Government should not be telling Kiwis what cars they can and cannot drive, and dictating to dealers what cars they can and cannot sell. The best way to green our vehicle fleet is to incentivise, not penalise, people to buy low-emission cars.

Our bottom line is you, which is why we’ll fight hard to stop Labour’s Car Tax.

New Zealanders can't afford this government.

Sign our petition today and help stop Labour penalising many hard-working Kiwis for buying the vehicles they want to drive.

kingdragonfly

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#2290862 6-Aug-2019 12:21

You forgot to USE CAPS LOCKS in your post. :)

Transferring money from gas-guzzlers to more efficient vehicle is at worst zero-sum.

In case you forgot, we live on an island and import most of of gasoline.

You may want to drive a hummer without government interference, and to hell with global change, but the rest of us care.

Rikkitic

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#2290865 6-Aug-2019 12:26

frednz:

New Zealanders can't afford this government.

My own personal feeling is that we can't afford another National government. More cows, more roads, more environmental degradation, more of the same old same old. Climate change is real, and the selfish class is just carping on and on about having to pay more for their oversized tanks.

Just to be clear, I drive an oversized tank myself. Not an SUV, god forbid, but a big, old sedan. I am a pensioner and cannot afford to upgrade. I justify it with the knowledge that I almost never use it and my actual carbon contribution is small. When the cost of petrol goes up, though, it hits me directly in the pocket, but I am still in favour of anything that hastens the transition away from our current way of doing things. If I ever have to replace my car, I hope better options will be available to me in my price range by then. I don't see any National government helping with that.

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

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