Fibre Landline and faxability?

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BarTender

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#1375187 27-Aug-2015 13:31

Just found a section from the Chorus NGA Voice TR-069 Technical User Guide:

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Ringing Cadences
The current NZ PSTN uses four Ringing (or Distinctive Alert (DA)) patterns/cadences for indicating the specific function required by the caller (for example telephone or facsimile).
Analogue lines may have distinctive ringing cadences applied, usually activated by dialling different telephone directory numbers.
NGA voice uses format of an "Initial Ringing" pulse, followed by analogue CLIP data sending, followed by one of the four existing PSTN Ringing cadences. This is different from the NZ PSTN which has traditionally not used a separate "Initial Ringing" pulse, and where applicable analogue CLIP data has been sent during the first long silent period between the first and second ringing cadences.
The NGA Voice Ringing cadences are as shown in the following table. Cadence ringing timings have tolerances of no more than ±10%.
-----

I suspect your Fax Machine is getting bent out of shape about the Inital Ringing.

clayton

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#1375213 27-Aug-2015 14:15

Very interesting, thanks for the information, I thought there were only 3 ringing cadences not 4? maybe that cadence is what we also need to test.
I agree most of the Brother fax machines are fussy with the ring pattern.

sbiddle

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#1375221 27-Aug-2015 14:27

clayton: Very interesting, thanks for the information, I thought there were only 3 ringing cadences not 4? maybe that cadence is what we also need to test.
I agree most of the Brother fax machines are fussy with the ring pattern.

There have always been 4 DA patterns, DA1-DA4. DA4 is the one used on the PSTN for faxability. From a post of mine on here a few years ago (TNA102 also contains these if you want to look on the Telepermit site)

DA 1 (normal ringing cadence):
400 ms on, 200 ms off,
400 ms on, 2000 ms off,
and repeated.
DA 2 : 400 ms on, 2600 ms off,
and repeated.
DA 3 : 400 ms on, 200 ms off,
400 ms on, 200 ms off,
400 ms on, 1400 ms off,
and repeated.
DA 4 : 400 ms on, 800 ms off,
400 ms on, 1400 ms off,
and repeated.

clayton

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#1375226 27-Aug-2015 14:42

I see,, DA1 is normal ringing, that's why it's not on my list thanks for clearing that up..

BarTender

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#1375250 27-Aug-2015 15:16

The TelePermit Site: http://www.telepermit.co.nz/resources_index.html

Or TNA102 specifically: http://www.telepermit.co.nz/TNA102.pdf

Section 6.4 is the one you are looking for.

Interestingly the TCF haven't adopted TNA102 as a standard, but since it's been around they are looking to adopt it from my understanding: http://www.tcf.org.nz/content/6f149c3b-68c4-476f-a531-f0ef19ceef43.html

clayton

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#1375263 27-Aug-2015 15:32

Excellent, I'll forward this information to Brother Japan and maybe a firmware update with fix the problem.. who know's!!!
Another thing I have also tried is to put the Brother machine in maintenance mode and change some settings to change the country from New Zealand to Australia, if set to Australia it will have a Distinctive Ring setting instead of Faxability.
The only settings for Distinctive Ring and Faxability is ON or OFF, that still didn't work.
With the OKI's I see they use DRD reception for faxability and DRD type 1-4, setting is set to 4 and faxes are coming through ok.

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BMarquis

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#1375273 27-Aug-2015 15:57

BarTender: Just found a section from the Chorus NGA Voice TR-069 Technical User Guide:

-----
Ringing Cadences
The current NZ PSTN uses four Ringing (or Distinctive Alert (DA)) patterns/cadences for indicating the specific function required by the caller (for example telephone or facsimile).
Analogue lines may have distinctive ringing cadences applied, usually activated by dialling different telephone directory numbers.
NGA voice uses format of an "Initial Ringing" pulse, followed by analogue CLIP data sending, followed by one of the four existing PSTN Ringing cadences. This is different from the NZ PSTN which has traditionally not used a separate "Initial Ringing" pulse, and where applicable analogue CLIP data has been sent during the first long silent period between the first and second ringing cadences.
The NGA Voice Ringing cadences are as shown in the following table. Cadence ringing timings have tolerances of no more than ±10%.
-----

I suspect your Fax Machine is getting bent out of shape about the Inital Ringing.

This.

Both NGA Voice and BBIP use an initial ring. This is allowed for, and perfectly acceptable in, ETSI and Telcordia/Bellcore standards.
TNA102 is (as per the wording inside TNA102) specifically for the TNZ/Spark PSTN.

Just one other terminology thing. Faxability is the Spark product name, which includes distinctive ringing, disabling call waiting during fax transmission, etc.
The Chorus/LLU/LFC portion is simply Distinctive Ringing.
Faxability and distinctive ringing aren’t interchangeable terms.

Clayton - Interested to hear you are dealing with brother, I'll send you a PM.

clayton

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#1375294 27-Aug-2015 16:40

Thanks guys for your PM's I'll get back to you soon, this forum is just getting better by the day!!
I need to contact Brother and find out exactly what they need, broken English does not help.
first reply was

If there is a specific modem compatibility needed the analog service required V34 is it different for fibre?

sbiddle

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#1375297 27-Aug-2015 16:46

One other option is to simply pick up an external fax switch if you can find one cheaply. Many supported both detection of fax tones, and also DR. These use to be really common but I suspect it's a case of most probably sitting in landfills now!

clayton

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#1375303 27-Aug-2015 16:56

haha, reminds me of when Atari fell from grace in 1983, they buried all their game cartridges in a landfill and was excavated in 2014, could be an option with the fax switch!! I do remember them.

clayton

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#1397586 30-Sep-2015 20:44

Just a update using Brother MFC with faxability on Fibre landline.
A firmware update from Brother has fixed the problem, updates for all machines should be rolled out in the next 4 weeks or so.
Thank you all for your input to resolve this issue.

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riahon

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#1397736 1-Oct-2015 07:22

clayton: Just a update using Brother MFC with faxability on Fibre landline.
A firmware update from Brother has fixed the problem, updates for all machines should be rolled out in the next 4 weeks or so.
Thank you all for your input to resolve this issue.

Thanks for the update Clayton

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