Chorus ETP with electrical wiring inside . Any comments on legality?

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K8Toledo

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#250824 27-May-2019 13:05

I could be wrong, but if my understating is correct electrical cable by law must be laid at least 400mm (or 200mm) away from TC cable, & certainly not in same conduit.

Admittedly it's been a few years since I looked at the Chorus TC Installation docs.

Could someone yay or nay this please? Thanks

The next part is a little long winded, sorry in advance.

It goes down a bit of a rabbit hole.....but GZ may appreciate the story....(I know my wife won't) :)

I took above pic while at clients house for an unrelated issue.

As we talked the client asked me was it possible to have residential internet & landline service, without constant disconnections? Apparently both were dropping every few days.

ISP is Vodafone. .

A week ago these VF customers lost WAN & landline for 6 days. After several calls to Vodafone Chorus were sent out - resulting (predictably, I hate to say) in VF CSR contacting customer with the "nothing wrong at our end...." & How about switching to 4G and see if that improves things? So that's what they did.

Unfortunately nothing changed.... Probably due to the house being four stories high, with lead insulated walls (or close to it) and the router plugged into BT jack located inside a pantry on the bottom floor. :D

Tbh the house is freaking enormous...s6 bedrooms, four car garage, heated covered outdoor Olympic pool, home automation system - which is also broken. lol.

The house two doors down synced @60Mb, so I figured may as well check the internal & external wiring.... .

Results indoors, 15/5 with 60dBA attn. Outside @ ETP: 59/15 17dBA.

So ofc now I have another job to do...:D

Fwiw the place was built 9yrs ago, it has home automation (which never works), professionally, an alarm, cameras, and intercom system, remote locking gate, professionally installed.

Checked ceiling too, sure enough Cat 5e to every room jackpoint, professionally installed, inc behind lounge TV lounge for Sky ppv, professionally installed.

What could possibly go wrong? Well as it turns out - everything.

On a side note, the home automation setup cost these clients $8K. The installer took $4K as deposit then flew off to Saudi Arabia - for a permanent holiday.. :P

Unfortunately that's only the tip of the iceberg..

*Edit* I'm due for an appointment -will post back later when time permits. (sorry...).

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#2246470 27-May-2019 13:24

Please keep us updated with what you find.

BarTender

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#2246552 27-May-2019 14:49

The ETP looks like a standard lead in plus scotchlocks connecting to two internal cables.

That's not ideal as I would expect a single connection from there to the DSL router, or see a master filter wired into the ETP.

That cream thing isn't a Master Filter, it would help if you had a photo showing how it was actually wired up.

But from how it looks I have seen better and worse.

But I would expect only a single isolated connection going via CAT5/6 to where the DSL router is, then a Master Filter at that point to distribute the POTS service around the house.

Lastly I assume UFB isn't in the horizon as that should solve any disconnection issues, but if the house is a huge and badly built as you say it is that will probably introduce all sorts of new issues.

CYaBro

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#2246555 27-May-2019 14:58

I think I can see a green earth cable running through the ETP, is that what you're talking about?

Is that the earth rod in the 2nd photo?

Opinions are my own and not the views of my employer.

chevrolux

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#2246558 27-May-2019 15:09

So firstly, that isn't a proper Telecom/Chorus ETP enclosure, it's just a standard electrical junction box.

Looks like there is flexible conduit coming up out of the ground - good luck pulling fibre through that depending on how far the flexi goes.

Then it looks like two cat5's coming in there too, so pretty good chance one goes to the alarm, and the other the actual "feed" in to the house. I would be installing a splitter in that ETP so you know you are filtered back as far as possible and then send the DSL in on a dedicated pair.

hio77

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Lizard Networks

#2246565 27-May-2019 15:31

Yup, that black cable is the 049 from the street by the looks of it, not a power cable.

As others have pointed out, it looks like one is the alarm wiring causing essentially a massive bridgetap close to the CPE (which has the most impact)

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gregmcc

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#2246603 27-May-2019 17:00

As far as running comms and power together, they can be right next to each other as long are they are effectively segregated, usually achieved by double insulation.

It is RECOMMENDED, that there should be at least 50mm spacing between the 2 to prevent interference between them. Looking at your pictures I can't see any thing mains rated in either picture, some clarification would good, maybe add an arrow point to the item.

InstallerUFB

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#2246607 27-May-2019 17:09

Yep non standard ETP (actual an electrical terminal box ) but these can be used for ETP

Black cable with 4 core is the standard UG service lead - two Three port connectors to a line terminator (no longer required but was used to prove house was terminated to the Telecom network) - 1 cat5 with single pair working

the other green wire (with white paint on it) looks like the House earth wire ( a ha someone already said that ) - that shouldnt be there if its for comms or the comms shouldnt be there if it was for the eth ( i think the sparky who did the pre-wire took a short cut and nobody called him on it ) but you arn't likely to be changing that now.

"Master Spliter" on the end of the UG lead (removeingthe terminator) and use a second "dedicated" pair in that cat5 and onwards to take the DSL straight to the Router

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Aredwood

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#2246608 27-May-2019 17:13

CYaBro:
I think I can see a green earth cable running through the ETP, is that what you're talking about?

Is that the earth rod in the 2nd photo?

I agree. That green cable definitely looks like the main earth cable for the house.

And that is definitely the earth rod in the 2nd photo.

hio77

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Lizard Networks

#2246611 27-May-2019 17:21

Aredwood:
CYaBro:

I think I can see a green earth cable running through the ETP, is that what you're talking about?

Is that the earth rod in the 2nd photo?

I agree. That green cable definitely looks like the main earth cable for the house.

And that is definitely the earth rod in the 2nd photo.

It's a hole, it fits... isnt that all that matters surely? ;)

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toejam316

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#2246636 27-May-2019 18:58

hio77:

Aredwood:
CYaBro:

I think I can see a green earth cable running through the ETP, is that what you're talking about?

Is that the earth rod in the 2nd photo?

I agree. That green cable definitely looks like the main earth cable for the house.

And that is definitely the earth rod in the 2nd photo.

It's a hole, it fits... isnt that all that matters surely? ;)

Are you sure you're not a Sky TV installer?

Anything I say is the ramblings of an ill informed, opinionated so-and-so, and not representative of any of my past, present or future employers, and is also probably best disregarded.

hio77

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#2246638 27-May-2019 19:06

toejam316:

hio77:

Aredwood:
CYaBro:

I think I can see a green earth cable running through the ETP, is that what you're talking about?

Is that the earth rod in the 2nd photo?

I agree. That green cable definitely looks like the main earth cable for the house.

And that is definitely the earth rod in the 2nd photo.

It's a hole, it fits... isnt that all that matters surely? ;)

Are you sure you're not a Sky TV installer?

pls, sky has standards... that's clearly a Visionstream install ;)

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gregmcc

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#2246646 27-May-2019 19:31

hio77:

Aredwood:
CYaBro:

I think I can see a green earth cable running through the ETP, is that what you're talking about?

Is that the earth rod in the 2nd photo?

I agree. That green cable definitely looks like the main earth cable for the house.

And that is definitely the earth rod in the 2nd photo.

It's a hole, it fits... isnt that all that matters surely? ;)

From memory there is nothing in AS/NZS3000 that does not allow running the main earth as shown in the pictures from the OP

Aredwood

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#2246693 27-May-2019 21:44

Still a fail from a maintenance point of view. If Chorus need to replace that junction box with a fibre ETP or proper copper Demarcation. An electrician will be needed to move that earth cable. Or might even need to be on site at the same time as Chorus, to disconnect and reconnect that earth cable.

Lots of extra expense just for the sake of not drilling another hole when the house was built.

K8Toledo

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#2247498 29-May-2019 08:27

Aredwood: Please keep us updated with what you find.

Hi, I'm returning to job today & will take some photos....(had to wait for patch panel to arrive).

A couple of observations to start with though:

Cat 5e was daisy chained to all up stairs jackpoints.

Downstairs lounge, office & one bedroom were wired in star config. However none of the cables were marked so I had to check every jackpoint in the house to work out which cable went to each room. Part of the house has a cathedral ceiling which is frustrating.

The alarm monitor installed is I.P. type with 4G for backup. Only 4G working as installer didn't connect the Ethernet cable... :)

I was unable get a connection from two of the RJ45 jacks downstairs. After some time I finally pulled of the wallplate... The 568B Cat 5 had been punched down to 568A RJ45 jacks.

Will post back..

BarTender

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#2247519 29-May-2019 08:59

K8Toledo:

Aredwood: Please keep us updated with what you find.

Hi, I'm returning to job today & will take some photos....(had to wait for patch panel to arrive).

A couple of observations to start with though:

Cat 5e was daisy chained to all up stairs jackpoints.

Downstairs lounge, office & one bedroom were wired in star config. However none of the cables were marked so I had to check every jackpoint in the house to work out which cable went to each room. Part of the house has a cathedral ceiling which is frustrating.

The alarm monitor installed is I.P. type with 4G for backup. Only 4G working as installer didn't connect the Ethernet cable... :)

I was unable get a connection from two of the RJ45 jacks downstairs. After some time I finally pulled of the wallplate... The 568B Cat 5 had been punched down to 568A RJ45 jacks.

Will post back..

I really hope you haven't quoted a fixed price for this gig...... As I would be running from it unless they plan to shower you in cash to fix up all the issues.

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