Apple and the Consumer Guarantees Act

Forums › Apple iOS and devices › Apple and the Consumer Guarantees Act

esawers

292 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 23

# 138079 19-Dec-2013 11:53

http://www.stuff.co.nz/technology/gadgets/30008163/apple-caught-lying-to-australian-customers

Thoughts on this?
I had an Ipad replaced under the Consumer Guarantees Act a few weeks ago, for screen bleed.
And a week later my iphone was replaced under warranty for failing the battery test.

Does this mean I would have been entitled to a refund instead of replacement?
(I know it says Australian law, but they appear to be the same in terms of repair/replace/refund)

1 | 2

I iz your trusted friend
5833 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 147

Mod Emeritus

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

# 954739 19-Dec-2013 12:03

Here's the Apple NZ's Statuory Warranty information: http://www.apple.com/nz/legal/statutory-warranty/

Internet is my backyard...

«Geekzone blog: Tech 'n Chips Takeaway» «Personal blog: And then...»

Please read the Geekzone's FUG

KevinL

656 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 20

Trusted

# 954742 19-Dec-2013 12:08

If it isn't a serious fault, they are entitled to decide the remedy (repair/replace/refund). If they refuse to repair the item or takes more than a reasonable length of time to do so, then you're entitled to a refund/replacement/cost of repairing elsewhere.

If it's a serious fault or cannot be fixed, you are entitled to a refund/replacement/partial repalcement and keep the goods.

http://www.consumeraffairs.govt.nz/for-consumers/law/consumer-guarantees-act/got-a-problem-with-goods

RunningMan

5444 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1895

# 954743 19-Dec-2013 12:10

Only if they couldn't fix the fault (which it appears they have).

Have a read of the Consumer Guarantees Act

specifically section 18

mattwnz

14886 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2019

# 954749 19-Dec-2013 12:18

I don't believe they can replace a new one with a refurbished one, as a refurbished one is worth less and potentially a lower resale value. So you may as well just buy a refurbished one to begin with and save on it.
Have people in NZ had problems getting their idevice fixed or replaced by apple directly?

tchart

1518 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 196

Trusted

# 954786 19-Dec-2013 12:54

esawers:
I had an Ipad replaced under the Consumer Guarantees Act a few weeks ago, for screen bleed.

Slightly off topic but how out of warranty was your device? My Samsung has some kind of screen bleed (its about 18 months old)

esawers

292 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 23

# 954792 19-Dec-2013 13:04

It was 16 months old (4 months out of warranty)
They were very friendly, before I had even mentioned the CGA they were saying 'Don't worry we will definelty look after you'
Looks like the Australian ruling is indicating up to two years old would be covered.

surfisup1000

4200 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1435

# 954830 19-Dec-2013 13:56

RunningMan: Only if they couldn't fix the fault (which it appears they have).

Have a read of the Consumer Guarantees Act

specifically section 18

You contradict yourself by referring to the actual act :)

Quoting..
Where the failure cannot be remedied or is of a substantial character within the meaning of section 21, the consumer may—
(a)subject to section 20, reject the goods

and, substantial character defn.

the goods would not have been acquired by a reasonable consumer fully acquainted with the nature and extent of the failure;

So, you can reject the goods if you wouldn't have purchased knowing the seriousness of the fault.

RunningMan

5444 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1895

# 954841 19-Dec-2013 14:14

One person supports this post

surfisup1000: You contradict yourself by referring to the actual act :)

Quoting..
Where the failure cannot be remedied or is of a substantial character within the meaning of section 21, the consumer may—
(a)subject to section 20, reject the goods

and, substantial character defn.

the goods would not have been acquired by a reasonable consumer fully acquainted with the nature and extent of the failure;

So, you can reject the goods if you wouldn't have purchased knowing the seriousness of the fault.

I was referring to the specific question that the OP asked. i.e. an entitlement to refund rather than replacement for the 16 month old device that developed screen bleed, or the device that failed the battery test.

IANAL but would think it unlikely (although not impossible) that that would meet the requirements of section 21, so I would have thought that would come back to section 18(2) where an opportunity to remedy must be given first (and in the OP's case, it has been remedied), and only then can the goods be rejected (refund).

bazzer

3295 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 211

Trusted

# 954885 19-Dec-2013 14:51

surfisup1000:
RunningMan: Only if they couldn't fix the fault (which it appears they have).

Have a read of the Consumer Guarantees Act

specifically section 18

You contradict yourself by referring to the actual act :)

Quoting..
Where the failure cannot be remedied or is of a substantial character within the meaning of section 21, the consumer may—
(a)subject to section 20, reject the goods

and, substantial character defn.

the goods would not have been acquired by a reasonable consumer fully acquainted with the nature and extent of the failure;

So, you can reject the goods if you wouldn't have purchased knowing the seriousness of the fault.

I don't believe that is the correct interpretation. No one would knowingly purchase goods with any fault, would they? So any fault could be considered to be of a substantial character.

surfisup1000

4200 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1435

# 954902 19-Dec-2013 15:18

bazzer:
I don't believe that is the correct interpretation. No one would knowingly purchase goods with any fault, would they? So any fault could be considered to be of a substantial character.

You are right -- but, how else can you interpret this? It seems pretty clear.

nathan

5124 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1431

Trusted

Microsoft

# 954918 19-Dec-2013 15:33

I had 3G on my iPad2 (purchased personally from Apple Online store) stop working, went around and around with Apple support hard resetting and trying multiple different SIMs while the device was in 1 year warranty, they send me a box to send it back to Australia

By the time I sent it in back to Australia it must have been out of the 1 year warranty as they just couriered the broken iPad back to me

Rang them up again, got shunted around onto a "product specialist" who just would not budge from the 1 year warranty thing. Complained, moaned, asked them for their NZ address to serve disputes tribunal papers on, nothing forthcoming

Got sick of it hung up, chucked the iPad in a cupboard and forgot about it

fast forward 2 years later till this morning

Rung up Apple support and immediately started quiting the NZ Consumer Guarantees Act and the Aussie equivalent and suddenly their tune had changed and they will fix this

Good on them for finally coming to the table but what a bloody hassle, it took them to be forced into it by the Aussie consumer protection laws

Apple do an amazing job of keeping up their margins, making people love them with their alluring brand, while shafting them and tricking them into buying AppleCare extended warranties at the same time

RunningMan

5444 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1895

# 954920 19-Dec-2013 15:33

surfisup1000:
bazzer:
I don't believe that is the correct interpretation. No one would knowingly purchase goods with any fault, would they? So any fault could be considered to be of a substantial character.

You are right -- but, how else can you interpret this? It seems pretty clear.

Presumably you are looking at section 21(a) - to me it implies that it applies to a fault that was present at the time of purchase, and wasn't pointed out to the buyer, as opposed to a fault which developed later.

nathan

5124 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1431

Trusted

Microsoft

# 954922 19-Dec-2013 15:34

chiefie: Here's the Apple NZ's Statuory Warranty information: http://www.apple.com/nz/legal/statutory-warranty/

interestingly this only recently changed to make any mention of the NZ CGA

prior to that it was just a standard 1 year warranty and tough sh*t

surfisup1000

4200 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1435

# 954926 19-Dec-2013 15:38

nathan:
chiefie: Here's the Apple NZ's Statuory Warranty information: http://www.apple.com/nz/legal/statutory-warranty/

interestingly this only recently changed to make any mention of the NZ CGA

prior to that it was just a standard 1 year warranty and tough sh*t

Hmmm, i had an apple product repaired outside warranty previously.

although, rather than saying 'under cga you are enititled...' , they said, 'becuase you are a good customer, this time we will repair'. This was after i explained the CGA to the nice support man in india. He had no idea.

chiefie

I iz your trusted friend
5833 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 147

Mod Emeritus

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

# 954933 19-Dec-2013 15:48

nathan:
chiefie: Here's the Apple NZ's Statuory Warranty information: http://www.apple.com/nz/legal/statutory-warranty/

interestingly this only recently changed to make any mention of the NZ CGA

prior to that it was just a standard 1 year warranty and tough sh*t

I found the Apple NZ's Statutory Warranty few months back, and I think it was around the time when iPhone 5s/iOS7 was mentioned, and the link was very visible in their products' pages (at the very bottom spot).

Internet is my backyard...

«Geekzone blog: Tech 'n Chips Takeaway» «Personal blog: And then...»

Please read the Geekzone's FUG

1 | 2