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  #2934293 25-Jun-2022 15:14
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lchiu7:

 

Batman:

 

we really should be assembling EVs locally

 

any random tech company can do it

 

For those with longer memories we used to assemble cars in NZ from CKD (completely knocked down) parts. One such assembly plant was in Porirua I think, now the site of a Bunnings.  But we need people who know how to assemble parts properly and not just install random tech. From what I have fit and finish are one of the areas where Tesla's don't quite meet people's expectations of a car's finish.

 

We used to assemble Suzukis in Whanganui, too.
One vehicle a day, thirty mini-FWDs one month, thirty miniature vans the next month. It was ludicrously expensive and inefficient, but you couldn't get import licenses for CBU (Completely Built Up) vehicles, you could for CKD packs. However, there were certain things that had to be "NZ Local content", IIRC that included wiring harnesses, seats, glass & tyres.
I once went to the factory in Wainuiomata that produced the seat pans, a couple of thousand was a big production run. They supplied us, Mitsubishi/Chrysler in Porirua, Ford/Mazda in Wiri, Holden in Trentham, and Toyota in Thames

 

In Hamamatsu, the main Suzuki factory, they would drive thirty vehicles - less than an hour's production - off the main line and around the corner to a big shed where they'd carefully disassemble the vehicles, returning the wiring harnesses, seats, glass & tyres back to the assembly line. Then they'd pack the disassembled vehicles into big wooden boxes to be shipped out here, re-assembled and then sold to the long suffering public.

 

Ah yes the Good Olde Days ... not

 

No we should not be assembling EVs or anything maybe other than 'hand built' luxury or special purpose vehicles in NZ
Never again




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  #2934295 25-Jun-2022 15:25
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PolicyGuy: No we should not be assembling EVs or anything maybe other than 'hand built' luxury or special purpose vehicles in NZ

To be clear you're objecting to inefficiency in the supply chain resulting in increased cost. Supply chains are very different today. Your suggested luxury vehicles for example would take advantage of that.

SomePostman
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  #2934301 25-Jun-2022 16:16
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lchiu7:

Just saw the following video on the BYD Atto 3 and it looks very interesting.


https://youtu.be/UvzRfUGAB_s


 


Rotating screen is nice and they will be providing Apple CarPlay and Android Auto later this year.


Didn't know it was being assembled in Australia which is I presume is where our ones will come from.



Not correct. They're being assembled in China for RHD with one one spec (but two battery sizes)



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  #2934302 25-Jun-2022 16:28
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PolicyGuy:

 

lchiu7:

 

For those with longer memories we used to assemble cars in NZ from CKD (completely knocked down) parts. One such assembly plant was in Porirua I think, now the site of a Bunnings.  But we need people who know how to assemble parts properly and not just install random tech. From what I have fit and finish are one of the areas where Tesla's don't quite meet people's expectations of a car's finish.

 

We used to assemble Suzukis in Whanganui, too.
One vehicle a day, thirty mini-FWDs one month, thirty miniature vans the next month. It was ludicrously expensive and inefficient, but you couldn't get import licenses for CBU (Completely Built Up) vehicles, you could for CKD packs. However, there were certain things that had to be "NZ Local content", IIRC that included wiring harnesses, seats, glass & tyres.
I once went to the factory in Wainuiomata that produced the seat pans, a couple of thousand was a big production run. They supplied us, Mitsubishi/Chrysler in Porirua, Ford/Mazda in Wiri, Holden in Trentham, and Toyota in Thames

 

In Hamamatsu, the main Suzuki factory, they would drive thirty vehicles - less than an hour's production - off the main line and around the corner to a big shed where they'd carefully disassemble the vehicles, returning the wiring harnesses, seats, glass & tyres back to the assembly line. Then they'd pack the disassembled vehicles into big wooden boxes to be shipped out here, re-assembled and then sold to the long suffering public.

 

Ah yes the Good Olde Days ... not

 

No we should not be assembling EVs or anything maybe other than 'hand built' luxury or special purpose vehicles in NZ
Never again

 

 

That may have been the case for Suzuki. It wasn't the case for the major brands of the time and I'm surprised it was even the case for Suzuki though perhaps their very small through put didn't warrant setting up a supply chain to crate up and ship all the minor parts prior to any assembly of the vehicles taking place.

 

To my knowledge most cars arrived as individual panels, along with components like engines, gear boxes, transmissions, steering systems etc which were assembled here in the same manner as they would have been in the country of origin. New Zealand made carpets, windows, wiring looms, exhaust systems, tyres etc being fitted at the New Zealand assembly plant.

 

While it may not have been as efficient as having them assembled in the country of origin it was nowhere near as inefficient as the method you describe in the Suzuki situation. There were some major industries/employers who relied upon local assembly which no longer exist.





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  #2934303 25-Jun-2022 16:28
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SomePostman:
lchiu7:

 

Just saw the following video on the BYD Atto 3 and it looks very interesting.

 

 

 

https://youtu.be/UvzRfUGAB_s

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Rotating screen is nice and they will be providing Apple CarPlay and Android Auto later this year.

 

 

 

Didn't know it was being assembled in Australia which is I presume is where our ones will come from.

 



Not correct. They're being assembled in China for RHD with one one spec (but two battery sizes)

 

 

 

Two oops here

 

 

 

1. Wrong video -should be this https://youtu.be/ay2mO7AlBU8

 

2. The guys says at 5"50 made in China but on a dedicated Australian production line (presumably our ones will come from the same line)

 

 





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  #2934328 25-Jun-2022 17:47
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wellygary:

gzt: Japan govt set 2035 all new cars will be clean energy vehicles. US$7200 subsidy. Tokyo local government set 2030. It has to happen or they will find markets for secondhand vehicles limited.


“Clean energy” includes regular hybrids.. Toyota threatened to throw its toys...


“The final version of the document, available online, refers to Japan's 2035 target of all new domestic car sales being "so-called electric-powered vehicles," and specifically mentions in the main text that such vehicles include hybrids.”


https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/exclusive-japan-emphasised-hybrids-policy-document-after-lawmaker-cited-lobbying-2022-06-24/


I'm not sure your conclusion is correct. The part about allowing hybrids. It depends on the rest of the text. For instance it may allow clean fuel hydrogen hybrids without compromising the target.

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  #2934542 26-Jun-2022 10:18
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One person's view only of course and an Australian to boot :-)  but he reckons the BYD Atto 3 won't get a 5 star ANCAP rating.

 

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gS_IaALNls

 

 

 

 





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  #2934738 27-Jun-2022 00:29
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Mazda begins MX30 campaign. Claims 18.5kWh per 100km average and highs of 12kw per 100km. Personally I agree with the small battery option that creates this claimed efficiency. Imo Mazda NZ have gone way too heavy in the rest of this and severely labour their point about promoting ICE fuel sources in an EV advertorial. Goodness me it's almost as if they want to discourage buyers.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/indepth/commercial/some-electric-cars-reduce-more-emissions-than-others/#no_universal_links

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  #2934740 27-Jun-2022 00:58
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gzt: Mazda begins MX30 campaign. Claims 18.5kWh per 100km average and highs of 12kw per 100km. Personally I agree with the small battery option that creates this claimed efficiency. Imo Mazda NZ have gone way too heavy in the rest of this and severely labour their point about promoting ICE fuel sources in an EV advertorial. Goodness me it's almost as if they want to discourage buyers.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/indepth/commercial/some-electric-cars-reduce-more-emissions-than-others/#no_universal_links


18.5kWh / 100 (185wh / 1km) is not great efficiency. A LEAF does better. My Tesla's efficiency after 14,500km was 158wh / 1km. My MG ZS EV is currently on 173wh / km. after the most recent 4500km.




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  #2934755 27-Jun-2022 07:37
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Mazda sold just 293 of those for the whole of 2022 so far in USA, its a poor effort but thats what they have.

 

https://insideevs.com/news/590142/us-mazda-mx30-sales-may2022/

 

 

 

I'm guessing they planned this as a range extender and obviously not scaled for mass production volumes because they dont have battery supply. The overall packaging of the vehicle is also off putting.


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  #2934780 27-Jun-2022 09:58
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Batman:

 

we really should be assembling EVs locally

 

any random tech company can do it

 

 

Car factories are big and capital intensive money furnaces,  you keep costs down by having significant output to keep the cost of assembly low, 

 

NZ has a tiny population, NZ gave up car assembly in the 80s/90s, Even Australia with its larger and richer population decided a few years ago that there were better uses for the pots of federal cash they had been pouring into Holden and Ford to keep local production alive...

 

Why would a car company wan to make cars more expensively for a small market, when it can service the market cheaper from global factories, 

 

It either needs restrictive border tariffs or govt funds to subsidize the local production, neither of which are on the horizon in NZ 


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  #2934783 27-Jun-2022 10:13
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"Any random tech company can do it"

 

 

 

Apart from Rivian after over a decade of planning,  same goes for lucid, and many other tech companies.

 

And car companies with 50 or 100 years of experience are struggling also.


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  #2934786 27-Jun-2022 10:21
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wellygary: Why would a car company wan to make cars more expensively for a small market, when it can service the market cheaper from global factories, It either needs restrictive border tariffs or govt funds to subsidize the local production, neither of which are on the horizon in NZ

Not true at all. NZ has many advantages. There are all kinds of products made in NZ for a global market.

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  #2934787 27-Jun-2022 10:27
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gzt:
wellygary: Why would a car company wan to make cars more expensively for a small market, when it can service the market cheaper from global factories, It either needs restrictive border tariffs or govt funds to subsidize the local production, neither of which are on the horizon in NZ

Not true at all. NZ has many advantages. There are all kinds of products made in NZ for a global market.

 

What comparative advantage does NZ have in EV Vehicle production??

 

Small market- not helpful 

 

Limited availability of Capital - not helpful 

 

Long distance from parts and raw materials manufacturing - not helpful, 

 

 


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  #2934788 27-Jun-2022 10:29
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If Tiwai point was taken over by a company such as Tesla they would have access to 100% renewable energy to make their vehicles/batteries and they could keep the smelter to make aluminium for the vehicles as well. We're also pretty close to Australia where they source a lot of their raw materials





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