Vodafone Sure Signal - Different ISP

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202 posts

Master Geek

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#1570018 11-Jun-2016 15:23

If you have the latest Femto they are 8 channels, there is a business 1 that is 32 but that is not cheap.

Any VFNZ phone that is 3G will be able to attach to it without doing anything. No other carriers device will be able to attach to it.

Anything I suggest or say is my own thoughts and not provided by anyone else unless stated

atomeara

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Ultimate Geek

#1570067 11-Jun-2016 16:18

I've managed to get it opened up once before for a "key customer" but they didn't really like doing it and more or less said why don't they get Vodafone broadband.

richms

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#1570083 11-Jun-2016 17:26

No registration needed. That is why a friends batch has teenagers clustering around outside it when the sure signal is turned on.

Richard rich.ms

MadEngineer

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#1570131 11-Jun-2016 19:24

I've found that calls drop when going into or leaving the range of these devices.

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froob

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#1570432 12-Jun-2016 12:40

I remembered seeing in this other thread that they will also work on WXC, because they are a Vodafone-owned company.

There was also a mention in this thread that a user managed to get one working via a VPN. No details included, by presumably through a VPN tunnel to a Vodafone broadband connection?

After a stuff.co.nz article on wi-fi calling ("When is wi-fi calling coming to NZ?"), I was hopeful that one or more of the mobile providers would implement this, and I'd no longer be tied to Sure Signal (or Cel-Fi as an expensive alternative). I understand the first step towards that is VoLTE, but there doesn't seem to have been any further news in that area since Spark's trial last year.

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raytaylor

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#1570773 12-Jun-2016 23:57

Vodafone will require you to have a vodafone internet connection unless you are using an approved isp and you go to that ISP for support regarding the device. You cannot call vodafone as their helpdesk is not trained to support them on other ISPs.

The manual says the booting time is usually an hour or two - when on another ISP it is about 24 hours.

The two I know of are us (Taylor Broadband) and Gisborne NET but above there is a comment it will work on WxC which I didnt know. Edit: I believe WIZ wireless has been trialing them too.

The approved ISPs have no way to mass provision the units, and there is a back channel for the ISP to do it on your behalf. They need to register the serial number of the suresignal to your static public ip address, and supply vodafone with a name and address where the unit is located.

Vodafone also make no guarantee that it will continue to work on the approved ISPs going forward.

One issue is that if there is an RBI subscriber in the area, it is possible they could lock on to your sure signal instead of the cell tower and use your internet data. So in rural areas, I am really careful where I install them.

Ray Taylor

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theUtmost

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#1606455 8-Aug-2016 17:03

raytaylor:

Vodafone will require you to have a vodafone internet connection unless you are using an approved isp and you go to that ISP for support regarding the device. You cannot call vodafone as their helpdesk is not trained to support them on other ISPs.

The manual says the booting time is usually an hour or two - when on another ISP it is about 24 hours.

The two I know of are us (Taylor Broadband) and Gisborne NET but above there is a comment it will work on WxC which I didnt know. Edit: I believe WIZ wireless has been trialing them too.

The approved ISPs have no way to mass provision the units, and there is a back channel for the ISP to do it on your behalf. They need to register the serial number of the suresignal to your static public ip address, and supply vodafone with a name and address where the unit is located.

Vodafone also make no guarantee that it will continue to work on the approved ISPs going forward.

One issue is that if there is an RBI subscriber in the area, it is possible they could lock on to your sure signal instead of the cell tower and use your internet data. So in rural areas, I am really careful where I install them.

Thanks for posting this info - I had thought it strange that VF were completely against running these on another ISP, period.

Now I learn it's all about the channel & support arrangements. I can understand that.

What I DON'T understand is why Vodafone NZ don't use the same concept as VF-UK.

In the UK, VF allow these devices onto ANY other ISP, provided you:

Register the Sure Signal serial number on your account for tracking purposes
Accept the disclaimer that it may cause extra traffic on your plan and VF won't reimburse you for that (this one takes care of broadband bill shock extra data use)
Individually approve the IMEI for EACH device that you want to connect to the SureSignal (this prevents random passersby connecting to your device & swamping it!)

That seems to me to be a way better and more flexible approach.

I have left an 8-channel SureSignal on a 2-degrees UFB connection (Enable Networks fibre) for 72 hours. No connection. Boo.

Same device works fine on Vodafone onnet VDSL, Vodafone offnet VDSL (via Chorus) and Vodafone bus fibre.

SO I know the device isn't bung. Seems like a very annoying artificial service limitation...

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raytaylor

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#1606486 8-Aug-2016 18:04

theUtmost:

Now I learn it's all about the channel & support arrangements. I can understand that.

What I DON'T understand is why Vodafone NZ don't use the same concept as VF-UK.

In the UK, VF allow these devices onto ANY other ISP, provided you:

Register the Sure Signal serial number on your account for tracking purposes
Accept the disclaimer that it may cause extra traffic on your plan and VF won't reimburse you for that (this one takes care of broadband bill shock extra data use)
Individually approve the IMEI for EACH device that you want to connect to the SureSignal (this prevents random passersby connecting to your device & swamping it!)

That seems to me to be a way better and more flexible approach.

I agree, and point 3 is definitely needed.

Though I notice many basement level bars in wellington use them, as do businesses where they would prefer to have them open. I guess they should retain that option.

Vodafone has simply unmetered them on vodafone dsl connections and so by doing that, they are easier to set up, support and they dont need to worry about training customers on how to register IMEIs etc.

Ray Taylor

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#1606572 8-Aug-2016 20:28

raytaylor:

Though I notice many basement level bars in wellington use them, as do businesses where they would prefer to have them open. I guess they should retain that option.

Vodafone has simply unmetered them on vodafone dsl connections and so by doing that, they are easier to set up, support and they dont need to worry about training customers on how to register IMEIs etc.

That's a very good point.

So, ideally, we'd want Vodafone to offer two different options for device setup (like that's every gonna happen!!!):

The residential config: Use any ISP, SureSignals locked to particular IMEIs, defined in the customer portal, customer has to acknowledge the potential data blowout.
The business config: Tied to Vodafone ISP only (or selected partners/RBI), zero-rated data, open to any IMEIs.

Just because I want to use one a particular way, doesn't mean the next customer does...

richms

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#1606577 8-Aug-2016 20:36

I would like to see a third option.

Minimal cost to liven up another port on the ONT just for a sure signal on its own leaving the internet connection alone

Richard rich.ms

nate

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#1606739 9-Aug-2016 09:33

I had one years ago when I was on Snap VDSL. We had a Vodafone ADSL connection at the office at that stage, so I setup a VPN to route traffic through that. Worked like a champ.

nzbsgfan

146 posts

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#1606811 9-Aug-2016 10:33

Vodafone UK adopted a more convoluted registration process to ensure their location - required for legal reasons. These units are effectively UMTS basestations and must be licenced to transmit. Knowing where these units are located is important. If the units are moved significantly I believe the registration process must be undertaken once again.

In the UK their system is closed by design. Management of the MSIDN list is the responsibility of the Femto owner.

Danz

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#1606882 9-Aug-2016 11:51

I believe vodafone will supply these as long as you have a static IP with another ISP.

Hopefully the telcos will support wifi calling sometime soon. This will eliminate these femtos

jjnz1

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#1606928 9-Aug-2016 12:47

Here is my write up which I posted to the VF forums: Works very well over a 4G Spark RBI connection!

http://community.vodafone.co.nz/t5/Broadband-services/Suresignal-with-wireless-RBI/m-p/201572#M18424

Okay. So just an update on using my Sure signal device over an RBI connection.

I had Vodafone 3G RBI for a while and even though the suresignal device kind of worked, you could still tell you weren't connected directly to a cell tower. Calls would go silent for a few seconds after a few minutes of use, and if it was a holiday period, it wasn't even worth trying to do anything other than text. I never experienced another VF RBI device from another property inadvertantly locking onto the Suresignal device (I accounted for all the data just for the testing period). That is not to say it can not happen, it just didn't happen to me.

Now, after trying a VF 3G RBI connection for a couple of months, I moved to another providers 4G RBI connection. So far my Suresignal experience has been faultless. I would even go a far as saying it was like living next to a real cell tower. Calls never faulted (even 40 minute ones), text messages came through always, and data was very very fast (when testing over 3G and not using wifi). I have noticed other people outside of my property using my Suresignal (and consequently my RBI data allowance) but to date, it has been minimal and I am prepared to cover that cost.

To summarize:

Don't attempt to operate a Suresignal device over a 3G connection. Be prepared to have a less than perfect experience if you do, and in which case I would recommend ensuring your 3G connection is at least a constant 2Mbps down and 2Mpbs up plus any additional bandwidth required for wifi use.

Using a Suresignal device over a 4G connection is fantastic and I would definatley recommend. Pings were low (<30ms), speed was great even during peak holiday periods (40Mbps down/30Mbps up), and multitasking was not a problem. I could hold at least 2 VF phone calls (thats all I tried during testing), stream 1x netflix kids show, stream 1x youtube kids show, and watch The Block ondemand via the Samsung TV, all at once....

Just remember, Using a Suresignal device in this manner is not supported, and will only work if you VPN into another Vodafone fixed line broadband connection. In my case, Vodafone UFB.

jjnz1

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#1606931 9-Aug-2016 12:53

What the above post doesn't mention, is how it works. If you scroll through link it will tell you that yes a VPN is required when outside the Vodafone fixed line broadband network, or outside the Vodafone 4G RBI network (for example 3G).

That VPN must connect back into the network somehow, and in my case, through my VF home fibre connection.

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