Auckland Weather 27/01/23 and Cyclone Gabrielle

Forums › Off topic › Auckland Weather 27/01/23 and Cyclone Gabrielle

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#3039099 19-Feb-2023 19:30

@tdgeek I withdrew the personal attack comment (with an edit) and apologise for making it. Unfortunately you had posted your reply. My response was ”in kind” and probably not appropriate.

If you are going to quote me, don’t leave the “reduced to zero” bit. At least we agree that NZ’s contribution is meaningless in a world population of 8 billion😁

I’m not going to comment further in this thread on Climate Change as there is already a well worn thread on that on GZ.

“We’ve arranged a society based on science and technology, in which nobody understands anything about science technology. Carl Sagan 1996

Geektastic

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#3039101 19-Feb-2023 19:35

I just had a thought. It may be in the thread somewhere already so apologies if I’m repeating it but TL:DR.

Had we all switched to electric cars, how would we now be charging them in those areas where there’s no power?

Petrol and diesel can be stored at home and can be flown in by helicopters etc. Electricity not so much.

It’s certainly an aspect of the whole EV push that needs consideration I think. There’ll be plenty of people grateful for their diesel utes etc. I imagine.

tdgeek

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#3039103 19-Feb-2023 19:41

Dingbatt:

@tdgeek I withdrew the personal attack comment (with an edit) and apologise for making it. Unfortunately you had posted your reply. My response was ”in kind” and probably not appropriate.

If you are going to quote me, don’t leave the “reduced to zero” bit. At least we agree that NZ’s contribution is meaningless in a world population of 8 billion😁

I’m not going to comment further in this thread on Climate Change as there is already a well worn thread on that on GZ.

i acknowedge that. Some believe in CC some don't. Ive watched/read many things on both sides. Yes NZ's contribution is meaningless, but I will qualify that my, as a Kiwi, contribution is meaningless. Same as one American in West Covina in LA and one Canadian in Canadia :-) I will recheck the "reduced to zero" comment now

tdgeek

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#3039105 19-Feb-2023 19:44

* Even if you reduce NZ’s 0.17% contribution to GHGs to zero while simultaneously crippling our primary income earners, it will make no difference.

That applies to all of us. If the Chinese, or Indians or Americans or Euros did that it makes no difference, as those populations are made up of individuals like me. Each of us = ONE no matter what passport you use

tdgeek

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#3039107 19-Feb-2023 19:47

Geektastic: I just had a thought. It may be in the thread somewhere already so apologies if I’m repeating it but TL:DR.

Had we all switched to electric cars, how would we now be charging them in those areas where there’s no power?

Petrol and diesel can be stored at home and can be flown in by helicopters etc. Electricity not so much.

It’s certainly an aspect of the whole EV push that needs consideration I think. There’ll be plenty of people grateful for their diesel utes etc. I imagine.

EVs are one of many things we need to change. Right now EVs are insignificant, so when they become significant we will have more electricity. Maybe 30 years maybe 8, preferably 8 or less

mudguard

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#3039109 19-Feb-2023 19:55

Geektastic: I just had a thought. It may be in the thread somewhere already so apologies if I’m repeating it but TL:DR.

Had we all switched to electric cars, how would we now be charging them in those areas where there’s no power?

Petrol and diesel can be stored at home and can be flown in by helicopters etc. Electricity not so much.

It’s certainly an aspect of the whole EV push that needs consideration I think. There’ll be plenty of people grateful for their diesel utes etc. I imagine.

On the other hand, if the house could draw from a car, the smallest Tesla could power our house for about five days. So I guess that's the trade off. Whereas a diesel ute will sit there if you're flooded in.

neb

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#3039110 19-Feb-2023 19:57

Geektastic: Petrol and diesel can be stored at home and can be flown in by helicopters etc. Electricity not so much. It’s certainly an aspect of the whole EV push that needs consideration I think. There’ll be plenty of people grateful for their diesel utes etc. I imagine.

In the current exceptional circumstances, sure, but overall it's optimising for the virtually unheard-of case and ignoring the all-the-time situation. It's a bit like people citing range anxiety for EVs because they remember a road trip they did in 1983 that exceeded the range of a current EV and so they can't get an EV even though the longest drive they normally do is to work or the supermarket, which incidentally has free chargers in the carpark so the tank is full when they've finished their shopping.

Also, if they have solar like some people in the other thread do, they'll be downright glad they don't have some diesel-guzzling vehicle when they can top up their car, at no cost, whenever they want and not have to worry about when the next diesel delivery will arrive, and how they'll get to where it is.

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ezbee

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#3039117 19-Feb-2023 20:05

Of more immediate concern...

Our resilience to natural disaster.

The problem is still with us for our lifetimes children's lifetimes and beyond.
Baked in for many decades or the odd millennia.

So no matter what else, we do have to deal with managing land use around floods, rising tides,
and earthquakes, with odd volcano thrown in.

Any climate fix
( Many coal plants are still being built where we have no control, plus other things ).
Well its going to be many decades if not millennia of change to come.
No matter if you think thats slower or faster.

Our response to land management, floods and land use etc you have to address either way.
North or South, East Cost, West Coast, we see examples of land erosion, and communities in danger.

So there are many things we need to do, aside from 'just' the 'climate issue'.

tdgeek

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#3039120 19-Feb-2023 20:11

ezbee:

Of more immediate concern...

Our resilience to natural disaster.

The problem is still with us for our lifetimes children's lifetimes and beyond.
Baked in for many decades or the odd millennia.

So no matter what else, we do have to deal with managing land use around floods, rising tides,
and earthquakes, with odd volcano thrown in.

Any climate fix
( Many coal plants are still being built where we have no control, plus other things ).
Well its going to be many decades if not millennia of change to come.
No matter if you think thats slower or faster.

Our response to land management, floods and land use etc you have to address either way.
North or South, East Cost, West Coast, we see examples of land erosion, and communities in danger.

So there are many things we need to do, aside from 'just' the 'climate issue'.

Agree. IMO its mitigation time. That has been in place for a while now, but not seriously, as its another generations problem, don't bother me I've got votes to get.

Given the many issues NZ wants to resolve (refer to political party comments/debates) its a huge ask for someone to actually do anything. Its a battle between $, votes (Central Govt and Local Govt) and what the public want. (who vote in Central and Local Govt)

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#3039124 19-Feb-2023 21:00

Reanalyse:

We purchased a ToolPRO Inverter Generator 2200W from Supercheap, should be enough to cycle (one at a time) through fridge, then vertical freezer and then electronics/tv/charge devices/led lights.

Noticed ( ) that the price has dropped from $949.00 pre cyclone to $799.00 now. Suggest do get an invertor generator as although lower power for cost will not fry your electronics.

gave me an idea. if you can wire this thing to an efficient EV to charge on the go, the EV can go a long distance (at slow speed) with a 20L jerry can in the boot.

Batman

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#3039126 19-Feb-2023 21:02

Reanalyse:

We purchased a ToolPRO Inverter Generator 2200W from Supercheap, should be enough to cycle (one at a time) through fridge, then vertical freezer and then electronics/tv/charge devices/led lights.

Noticed ( ) that the price has dropped from $949.00 pre cyclone to $799.00 now. Suggest do get an invertor generator as although lower power for cost will not fry your electronics.

what's the size of this generator?

neb

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#3039129 19-Feb-2023 21:09

Batman:
gave me an idea. if you can wire this thing to an efficient EV to charge on the go, the EV can go a long distance (at slow speed) with a 20L jerry can in the boot.

There's actually a much simpler solution, with all the firewood lying around everywhere you could run these cars more or less forever at no cost.

eonsim

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#3039137 19-Feb-2023 21:35

Geektastic: I just had a thought. It may be in the thread somewhere already so apologies if I’m repeating it but TL:DR.

Had we all switched to electric cars, how would we now be charging them in those areas where there’s no power?

Petrol and diesel can be stored at home and can be flown in by helicopters etc. Electricity not so much.

It’s certainly an aspect of the whole EV push that needs consideration I think. There’ll be plenty of people grateful for their diesel utes etc. I imagine.

Solar or if you are in the country side in the right area small wind turbines or micro hydro-power. As the climate becomes less predictable there is a need to switch to distributed power systems with increased resilience.

Electricity is actually better in some ways than petrol/diesel as if you are cut off you can generate your own. Rather than being reliant on external parties to provide it to you, and hoping the natural disaster doesn't take out the storage or distribution facilities.

Take Napier for an example, ~24,000 households.

If half of them have a basic electric car with 40kWh of power, and they had charged those over night with the storm warning and have V2G, that's 480,000kWh of stored power in the city, or ~7kWh per person.

If half of the population have a standard 5kW solar system, at this time of year the city could generate 360,000kWh of power conservatively per day (winter maybe 100,000kWh) ~5.5kWh per person.

That's a lot of power, now even if they weren't in a micro-grid with an emergency mode that limited power draw per household, we are talking about enough power that you could plug an extension cable into the house of someone with solar and throw it over the fence to the next-door neighbor with out solar. That would provide enough power that they could run their fridge/freezer, TV, phones and a laptop or two. The average fridge and TV draw a couple of kWh's of power each a day, throw in another 2 for any other devices and that's 6 kWh per household x2, or 12kWh of baseline power a day leaving 18kWh for the car. That's enough power for ~100km driving per day which is more than you will likely need in the middle of a disaster. If you added hotwater to the power use of the house hold with the solar, that maybe another 6kWh (non-heatpump) leaving you with 12kWh for the car or 60km...

If you went with high penetration of Solar or Electric cars the amount of power store and producible get pretty large and every house hold would potentially have 30kWh each enough to run there baseline power, AC, hot water and add 100km range to the car . Assume a 7kW system (closer the current Australian average) and it's closer over 500MWh of power generated a day (40 per household). If it was the middle of winter then the solar systems would generate more like 12-15kWh per day on average so skimping on power for a day or two and you could charge your car enough to do >100km assuming it had started out empty.

In a proper microgrid set up there would likely be additional community solar systems set up at public halls, sports facilities, warehouses and businesses. Such systems could be much larger than what was needed for a single house hold and would likely be able to supply dozens of household around them.

GV27

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#3039184 20-Feb-2023 06:14

We've lost hot water in West Auckland. Unsure if it's a bjorked cylinder or power shaping by Vector as they work on other bits of Auckland with storm damage.

sir1963

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#3039186 20-Feb-2023 07:25

Geektastic: I just had a thought. It may be in the thread somewhere already so apologies if I’m repeating it but TL:DR.

Had we all switched to electric cars, how would we now be charging them in those areas where there’s no power?

Petrol and diesel can be stored at home and can be flown in by helicopters etc. Electricity not so much.

It’s certainly an aspect of the whole EV push that needs consideration I think. There’ll be plenty of people grateful for their diesel utes etc. I imagine.

Now add in this bit of information.

We currently get 48% of our energy needs from Fossil fuels.

Electricity supply 24%

We do not have enough electricity by a lang shot to replace all vehicles with electric.

NOW also think about the "new" ideology of no one having cars, public transport will do it all, because that is where designs are heading.

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