TiVo Service ending on 31 October 2017

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148 posts

Master Geek

#1732194 7-Mar-2017 01:03

Ive emailed Freeview NZ, & asked about extending the EPG.

Got a reply saying that there are no plans to extend the EPG guide to more than 8 days.

old3eyes

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#1732236 7-Mar-2017 08:37

Just wondering if there is some way of decrypting the TiVo recordings I have downloaded to my PC?? Most small items of interest (5 or 6) . I can play them on my PC using the HNP but no way of editing them..

Regards,

Old3eyes

DMCM

78 posts

Master Geek

#1732238 7-Mar-2017 08:40

old3eyes:

Just wondering if there is some way of decrypting the TiVo recordings I have downloaded to my PC?? Most small items of interest (5 or 6) . I can play them on my PC using the HNP but no way of editing them..

I have played around with this quite a lot, never managed to do it though.

kevwest

9 posts

Wannabe Geek

#1732256 7-Mar-2017 09:09

old3eyes:

Just wondering if there is some way of decrypting the TiVo recordings I have downloaded to my PC?? Most small items of interest (5 or 6) . I can play them on my PC using the HNP but no way of editing them..

I have been using "Pavtube" It is capable of converting TiVo recordings to a range of playable formats. After converting I run them through "Videoredo TV Suite" for any editing.

old3eyes

9120 posts

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#1732262 7-Mar-2017 09:23

kevwest:

old3eyes:

Just wondering if there is some way of decrypting the TiVo recordings I have downloaded to my PC?? Most small items of interest (5 or 6) . I can play them on my PC using the HNP but no way of editing them..

I have been using "Pavtube" It is capable of converting TiVo recordings to a range of playable formats. After converting I run them through "Videoredo TV Suite" for any editing.

Thanx. Videoredo does natively decrypt TiVo files and edit them but last time I looked at it the price was about US$120 ish and as I have several video editing software packs installed I thought it was yet another expense plus I found the trial not wonderful to use though it may have changed. I'll have a look at "Pavtube" though..

Regards,

Old3eyes

Dynamic

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#1732263 7-Mar-2017 09:23

sarahfoxnz: Ive emailed Freeview NZ, & asked about extending the EPG.

Got a reply saying that there are no plans to extend the EPG guide to more than 8 days.

Thank you for trying! Don't suppose you want to contact Tivo USA and ask if they will help us out? :)

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DMCM

78 posts

Master Geek

#1732287 7-Mar-2017 09:38

So, at this point I feel we, the Tivo user community, have the following options available

1. Persuade Tivo (Tivo.com or and Hybrid TV or whoever) to pass over their control to some other nominated party that can run their EPG service. Personally I think this is highly unlikely as they would lose control of the Tivo NZ domain and effectively the Tivo brand. Remember the U.S. Tivo brand is alive and well.

2. Get a Tivo HDD to a group of Linux experts for assessment. If they can decrypt the drive, then it would be most likely easy to get the config that has the server / service whatever it connects to to download it's EPG. If this can be done then it's a case of standing up a new server with an appropriate service to allow an EPG download. Tivo.com lose al control of their device at this point obviously. In terms of cost, probably the user base would need to pay for this, but likely a few dollars per month, depending on interest. If there really are 10K active Tivo's out there, I'm betting a bit chunk of these would pay up to $5 per month - especially when you explain the alternatives! Running our own service would entail:

-Standing up a server (hundreds per month). Patching and redundancy is covered if this is a cloud based server. Very little sysadmin input required.

-Writing a web service to expose the EPEG to the Tivo (I can do this). After it is written is does not need to be maintained.

-Hiring a student or similar on a weekly basis (a few hours per week) to update the EPG.

So economically, you'd probably only need 500 users subscribed to cover it at $5 per month, so I think subscription cost could be lower...

Edit: Correct typos

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Dynamic

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#1732303 7-Mar-2017 09:45

DMCM: .....If they can decrypt the drive, then it would be most likely easy to get the config that has the server / service whatever it connects to to download it's EPG....

I suspect that would be the biggest trick. I believe we know the system has some encryption, so decrypting it, MODIFYING the server address the device reaches out to, and then saving this new config back to the Tivo. This update would need to be packaged in a way to make it simple, otherwise the uptake will be tiny and not economically viable.

The alternative of intercepting the DNS request and redirecting it would be beyond the equipment that most Tivo users would have at home.

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timbosan

2159 posts

Uber Geek

#1732304 7-Mar-2017 09:45

DMCM:

So, at this point I feel we, the Tivo user community, have the following options available

1. Persuade Tivo (Tivo.com or and Hybrid TV or whoever) to pass over their control to some other nominated party that can run their EPG service. Personally I think this is highly unlikely as they would lose control of the Tivo NZ domain and effectively the Tivo brand. Remember the U.S. Tivo brand is alive and well.

2. Get a Tivo HDD to a group of Linux experts for assessment. If they can decrypt the drive, then it would be most likely easy to get the config that has the server / service whatever it connects to to download it's EPG. If this can be done then it's a case of standing up a new server with an appropriate service to allow an EPG download. Tivo.com lose al control of their device at this point obviously. In terms of cost, probably the user base would need to pay for this, but likely a few dollars per month, depending on interest. If there really are 10K active Tivo's out there, I'm betting a bit chunk of these would pay up to $5 per month - especially when you explain the alternatives! Running our own service would entail:

-Standing up a server (hundreds per month). Patching and redundancy is covered if this is a cloud based server. Very little sysadmin input required.

-Writing a web service to expose the EPEG to the Tivo (I can do this). After it is written is does not need to be maintained.

-Hiring a student or similar on a weekly basis (a few hours per week) to update the EPG.

So economically, you'd probably only need 500 users subscribed to cover it at $5 per month, so I think subscription cost could be lower...

Edit: Correct typos

I think you are looking at this wrong - rather than muck around trying to decrypt hard drives I would simply use a network tools such as WireShark or Fiddler. I would assume (as a software dev myself) that the Tivo will be making a series of API calls to a known endpoint, probably based in a DNS name but could be an IP. If we wanted to replace it, it would either be a matter of:

1. Intercepting this on a local network basis. I think this was done on the original TIVO's?
2. taking over the DNS entry (assuming it is freed up by Hybrid when they close)

The first option is quite simple to set up, the problem comes from the data stream excepted by the TIVO. If it is encrypted, the job will be very hard. If it is simply the public EPG data, it should be easy. I would hope its open and in some nice format like XML or JSON.

In regards to updating the EPG, this can be done automatically based on the EPG from the DVB-S service, no need for any human intervention.

I am keen to help on this (I have a TIVO).

Dynamic

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#1732353 7-Mar-2017 10:35

I've just attempted to send an email to Tim Boys who (used to?) head up Hybrid TV for the Seven West Network, asking for contact information to discuss possibly taking over providing EPG for NZ Tivos.

Assuming I have guessed his email address correctly, I'll post a summary of the response.

“Don't believe anything you read on the net. Except this. Well, including this, I suppose.” Douglas Adams

Referral links to services I use, really like, and may be rewarded if you sign up:
PocketSmith for budgeting and personal finance management. A great Kiwi company.

DMCM

78 posts

Master Geek

#1732364 7-Mar-2017 10:59

timbosan:

DMCM:

So, at this point I feel we, the Tivo user community, have the following options available

1. Persuade Tivo (Tivo.com or and Hybrid TV or whoever) to pass over their control to some other nominated party that can run their EPG service. Personally I think this is highly unlikely as they would lose control of the Tivo NZ domain and effectively the Tivo brand. Remember the U.S. Tivo brand is alive and well.

2. Get a Tivo HDD to a group of Linux experts for assessment. If they can decrypt the drive, then it would be most likely easy to get the config that has the server / service whatever it connects to to download it's EPG. If this can be done then it's a case of standing up a new server with an appropriate service to allow an EPG download. Tivo.com lose al control of their device at this point obviously. In terms of cost, probably the user base would need to pay for this, but likely a few dollars per month, depending on interest. If there really are 10K active Tivo's out there, I'm betting a bit chunk of these would pay up to $5 per month - especially when you explain the alternatives! Running our own service would entail:

-Standing up a server (hundreds per month). Patching and redundancy is covered if this is a cloud based server. Very little sysadmin input required.

-Writing a web service to expose the EPEG to the Tivo (I can do this). After it is written is does not need to be maintained.

-Hiring a student or similar on a weekly basis (a few hours per week) to update the EPG.

So economically, you'd probably only need 500 users subscribed to cover it at $5 per month, so I think subscription cost could be lower...

Edit: Correct typos

I think you are looking at this wrong - rather than muck around trying to decrypt hard drives I would simply use a network tools such as WireShark or Fiddler. I would assume (as a software dev myself) that the Tivo will be making a series of API calls to a known endpoint, probably based in a DNS name but could be an IP. If we wanted to replace it, it would either be a matter of:

1. Intercepting this on a local network basis. I think this was done on the original TIVO's?
2. taking over the DNS entry (assuming it is freed up by Hybrid when they close)

The first option is quite simple to set up, the problem comes from the data stream excepted by the TIVO. If it is encrypted, the job will be very hard. If it is simply the public EPG data, it should be easy. I would hope its open and in some nice format like XML or JSON.

In regards to updating the EPG, this can be done automatically based on the EPG from the DVB-S service, no need for any human intervention.

I am keen to help on this (I have a TIVO).

I agree - although I'm not sure if Hybrid would free up (or even own) the DNS entry? Dunno. Whatever is easier. I tried fiddling around with wireshark on the weekend but you need to use a paid extension for wifi sniffing on Windows and I didn't want to move my tivo (use a cable).

Spong

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#1732365 7-Mar-2017 11:06

old3eyes:

Just wondering if there is some way of decrypting the TiVo recordings I have downloaded to my PC?? Most small items of interest (5 or 6) . I can play them on my PC using the HNP but no way of editing them..

I've used the free Java based program: kmttg See:https://sourceforge.net/projects/kmttg/ to transfer and decrypt video files from my Tivos, but I do have the HNP to allow access to the Tivo. From within kmttg you can convert to the file format you choose, and I've successfully edited them (externally), uploaded to Youtube, made DVDs etc with the resulting files.

Tivo upgrades to operate with the new OzTivo EPG, support and service. Over 400 performed here so far. See: www.hillcrest.net.nz

old3eyes

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#1732375 7-Mar-2017 11:26

Spong:

old3eyes:

Just wondering if there is some way of decrypting the TiVo recordings I have downloaded to my PC?? Most small items of interest (5 or 6) . I can play them on my PC using the HNP but no way of editing them..

I've used the free Java based program: kmttg See:https://sourceforge.net/projects/kmttg/ to transfer and decrypt video files from my Tivos, but I do have the HNP to allow access to the Tivo. From within kmttg you can convert to the file format you choose, and I've successfully edited them (externally), uploaded to Youtube, made DVDs etc with the resulting files.

Thanx for the info..

Regards,

Old3eyes

mattwnz

20164 posts

Uber Geek

#1732423 7-Mar-2017 12:31

Dynamic:
I've just attempted to send an email to Tim Boys who (used to?) head up Hybrid TV for the Seven West Network, asking for contact information to discuss possibly taking over providing EPG for NZ Tivos.

Assuming I have guessed his email address correctly, I'll post a summary of the response.

Why should tivo customers have to do this? Surely tivo should be getting a new provider in this area or be doing it out of the US. These boxes were always advertised to come with a epg that would last for the life of the box

DMCM

78 posts

Master Geek

#1732448 7-Mar-2017 12:49

I feel like I'm jumping all over the place here, but this appears to be a DVB-T box?

http://www.world-of-satellite.co.uk/satellite-and-terrestrial/digital-receivers/vu-plus/VU-Plus-Duo2-Duo-2-1x-Twin-Tuner-DVB-DVB-C-T-T2-HD-Enigma-2-Linux-Satellite-Receiver

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