Climate change: What can you do to help halt global warming and when will you do it?

Forums › Off topic › Climate change: What can you do to help halt global warming and when will you do it?

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Awrrr
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#2381522 26-Dec-2019 19:17

I truly wish there was some way to hold politicians accountable for their actions. By the time the consequences of their criminal negligence become apparent, they are dead or reclining in comfortable retirement. I wish someone would drop Morrison into a burnt-out forest and let him listen to the koala screams for awhile. Maybe he could pray for rain. Maybe he could be joined by that stable genius Donald Trump, who could tell the blackened trees how climate change is a left-wing hoax. These people disgust me. I hope they rot in their respective hells. I hope they are made to suffer.

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tdgeek

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#2381526 26-Dec-2019 19:34

Rikkitic:

I truly wish there was some way to hold politicians accountable for their actions. By the time the consequences of their criminal negligence become apparent, they are dead or reclining in comfortable retirement. I wish someone would drop Morrison into a burnt-out forest and let him listen to the koala screams for awhile. Maybe he could pray for rain. Maybe he could be joined by that stable genius Donald Trump, who could tell the blackened trees how climate change is a left-wing hoax. These people disgust me. I hope they rot in their respective hells. I hope they are made to suffer.

I agree, but who put him there, and others? The people. The people need to speak.

kingdragonfly

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#2381661 27-Dec-2019 11:03

More garbage spewing from Trump's mouth about renewable energy, from windmills.

By his thinking no one has studied windmills more than him (Also by his admission, he's the foremost expert on missile technology, and it only took him a day to learn.)

From his description, besides causing cancer the emissions created by windmills fill a significant part of the earth. Sorry Trump there's no piles of dead bald eagles under windmills.

All this started, of course, when off-shore windmills were placed near his Scotland golf course, which he has never forgiven.

kingdragonfly

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#2382339 29-Dec-2019 08:02

Mural mocking Scott Morrison for Hawaii holiday during bushfires painted over

Rikkitic

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#2382360 29-Dec-2019 09:30

A shame about the mural but good that it will live on bigger than ever on T-shirts, posters, tweets, and other media. Maybe a new one should be painted shaming NSW Emergency Services Minister David Elliott and all the other government wonkers who don't give a damn about the misery of ordinary people! The sooner these arrogant pricks get unelected, the better!

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kingdragonfly

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#2382406 29-Dec-2019 11:35

Scott Morrison. I'm not sure how much the Hawaii trip cost, but for trips abroad overseas security cost $10 million a year.

This is his extended second vacation this year, the other being Fiji.

I wonder if he was joined by some coal and fossil fuel lobbyists along for the trip, to make sure he was still their lap dog.

Guardian: Volunteer NSW firefighters to be compensated, government says

Scott Morrison bows to pressure from Labor and his own minister over those who lose income while fighting fires

The Morrison government has announced that rural New South Wales fire service volunteers will be compensated for loss of income, after weeks of mounting pressure from the community, political rivals and within its own party.

Just days after the minister Darren Chester broke ranks and joined Labor calls for volunteer firefighters to be paid, the prime minister announced eligible volunteers would receive $300 a day up to $6,000 if called out for more than 10 days this fire season.

Morrison had previously resisted the idea of paying volunteers, at first calling it a distraction before saying it was the domain of the states and something that would be examined in conjunction with state and fire authority leaders after the crisis had passed.

Despite growing community unrest over the amount of paid work volunteers were being forced to give up in order to continue tackling the wildfire emergency, Morrison said the announcement was not about paying volunteers but “sustaining volunteer effort” and came as a result of a direct request and consultation with fire chiefs and the NSW government.
...

Independent Volunteer firefighter sacrifices own house to save others in Australia wildfires: ‘We have jobs to do’

The man returned to his home in the morning – and found it in ruins

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#2382621 29-Dec-2019 19:08

Not sure if Auckland, and large Australian cities have same problem

New York Times Why Is New York City’s Skyline Always Lit Up?

...Con Edison, the utility that provides power to New York, estimated that 5,200 megawatt-hours of electricity keep Manhattan lit overnight.

...emergency exits usually stay lit — even when many New Yorkers are sleeping.

...The Federal Aviation Administration generally requires that buildings higher than 60 meters, or about 20 stories, be lit or marked by light. On some of Manhattan’s larger towers, for instance, a red light blinks atop a long antenna.

For new buildings that are slated to exceed 200 feet, the F.A.A. asks developers to complete an aeronautical study to determine whether the structure needs lights to avoid potential hazards to airplanes and helicopters.

...The New York night skyline is still responsible for about 1.7 billion pounds of planet-warming CO2 a year, said Mr. Catuogno.

The 1.7 billion pounds account for about 1.5 percent of the city’s annual greenhouse gas emissions, according to an estimate by Con Edison.

...Light pollution is also a scourge for nocturnal animals, interfering with reproduction and migration. Birds, for example, that are drawn to light may crash into buildings, particularly ones with transparent or reflective windows.

These collisions kill as many as 230,000 birds in the city every year, according to New York City Audubon.
...

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#2383550 31-Dec-2019 23:24

This is Mallacoota, Victoria - Australia - Happy 2020 Australia.

“I want children growing up in Australia to feel positive about their future, and I think it is important we give them that confidence that they will not only have a wonderful country and pristine environment to live in, that they will also have an economy to live in as well. I don’t want kids to have needless anxieties.’ - Scott Morrison

Tinkerisk

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#2383563 1-Jan-2020 01:55

NOT visiting NZ/AUS with the whole family for vacances despite the massive advertisments and offers here in radio and TV broadcasts. Sorry guys and Happy New Year! ;-)

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Talkiet

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#2384300 2-Jan-2020 18:10

[copied from another thread to avoid angering the Tesla EVangelists and mods]

Linuxluver:

Talkiet:

RobDickinson:

why are you on a thread about a 4 door saloon wanting to replace a v8 SUV?

Because I love cars and technology - and I would love to have an electric vehicle when it makes sense. Someone on the thread asked what sort of range someone needed and I piped up with my specific situation... However it appears that having odd requirements is offensive to some so I deeply regret it.

I've learnt much about the Model 3 through the personal experiences of people here and the links posted... However probably the biggest thing I have learnt is that some Model 3 owners seem to think everyone should be getting electric cars now and forget that they are in a position to buy a $76-$120k vehicle... VERY few people in NZ are in that position and the 'affordable' EV (The Leaf) is massively range constrained.

N.

There are people in these threads who feel a certain urgency about addressing climate change. I'm one of them. To be seeing what we are now seeing on a planetary scale actually in real-time in single-digit years is a siren-howling, red-light-flashing emergency to any sane person. The permafrost melting. The glacier melt accelerating. Sea levels rising in some places at 1cm / year or more. All happening on timescales more rapidly than almost anyone predicted.

We've squandered 30+ years during which time we might have avoided some of what is to come....and this show is only just getting started.

So with that in mind.....we encounter people who won't lift a finger to address this unless and until they can tow their boat 600km somewhere - without charging. It's a bit maddening to see people be so obtuse about the biggest threat the human race has ever faced. Why have a boat at all AND need to take it so far....when the future is at stake? Not that they understand that to be the case. A bit like the First Class passengers on the Titanic who couldn't understand why the servants on the ship wouldn't draw them a nice hot bath as the boat sank. Of course it won't sink. Don't be alarmist. Everything is fine, right? It's warm. The lights are on. All good.

It's hard to explain this to people who don't yet understand how serious this is.......because it's slow and everything seems "normal"....unless you're Inuit, or Yakutian or Australian.......or....etc people already profoundly affected by climate change.

You may be challenged about "requirements" not consistent with a livable planet for our kids and theirs. Don't mean to be rude.....but there's a emergency going on and we've already wasted almost 40 years.....

EVs are just one way individuals can actually do something. There aren't actually that many.....but this is one.

There's a lot to unpack there...

For a start, I don't even have a boat. Someone assumed that and never bothered to get the facts - but who lets facts get in the way of a good discussion :-)

Don't lift a finger? I'll wager I have a smaller carbon footprint (or whatever the metric is) than most people on here - so if there's someone with an expensive EV that also has children (I genuinely don't know if that's you and didn't go stalking posts to check - but I am sure some do), then I hope they aren't accusing others of not doing anything...

Anyway, if it's as bad as you say (and I'm not saying it isn't) then we're way past the point of a tiny minority of financially well off AND principled individuals being able to make any meaningful change... If the Titanic is sinking wouldn't you rather spend the last few hours in First Class instead of steerage?

I believe in climate change, but I don't believe that banning single use plastic bags from supermarkets and takeaways in NZ, and a few very well off people buying an EV instead of an ICE car are going to help. Maybe once we're able to ban plastic labels on fresh fruit we'll be getting somewhere.

What would I do?

- Huge tax breaks in the lower brackets for not having lots of kids. (Yeah, that's very "One Child" like and while that was a failed experiment on many metrics - it DID reduce the number of children)

- Increase RUCs dramatically for EVs but introduce govt subsidies to bring their capital pricing much closer to ICE cars - including secondhand. (This would hopefully trade away some of the upfront barrier to ICE uptake while still reflecting the need to recover costs to maintain the roading network)

- Big tax increases on meat and all luxury goods. (which will all get passed through to voters/consumers)

- Massive emissions tax on local polluters (which will all get passed through to voters/consumers)

For a start - however any party that's going to want to enact dramatic policies like this will get voted out after one term after people realise that we're not (as a society) ready to make the sacrifices needed.

Fatalistic? Perhaps, but doing things like banning single use plastic bags and trying to ban plastic labels on fruit and thinking that's doing any good whatsoever in the bigger picture is worse than doing nothing... It's possible to say "Look how well we've done, we've solved plastic!!!!" and happily use that to buffer our guilt and not make any bigger changes.

Of course, even if we do all the above, New Zealand comprises about 0.6% of the world population, and (I may have done this math wrong) less than 0.1% of world GDP (GWP). So, even if NZ transformed overnight into a 100% sustainably electrically powered, vegetarian based society - how much would it help the planet?

I'm accused of many things - and many of those accusations are true. I'm frequently accused of being a realist.

Cheers - N

Please note all comments are from my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.

Rikkitic

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#2384306 2-Jan-2020 18:39

Talkiet:

Of course, even if we do all the above, New Zealand comprises about 0.6% of the world population, and (I may have done this math wrong) less than 0.1% of world GDP (GWP). So, even if NZ transformed overnight into a 100% sustainably electrically powered, vegetarian based society - how much would it help the planet?

People keep making these kinds of arguments. They are based on faulty logic and I find it incredible that those making them can't seem to see this.

1. The plastic bag argument. Of course this won't make a meaningful difference, though it may spare a whale or two a bad tummy ache. But that is not the point. The point is that it makes a gesture and illustrates a point of principle. It says that a turning point has been reached and change - however small- is being made. It says that the issue is being taken seriously and at least some people care about it. It is SYMBOLIC. Think of it as a first class passenger offering a deck chair to a third class one. It won't stop the ship from sinking but it might make the survivors think a little about helping their fellow human.

2. We are such a small part of the problem that whatever we do won't make a difference so why bother doing anything? Again, someone has to go first. It has symbolic value, but also more than just that. It sets an example and shames those who refuse to put their drinks down and leave the bar, in spite of the ship's tilt.

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#2384308 2-Jan-2020 18:46

Rikkitic:
Talkiet:

Of course, even if we do all the above, New Zealand comprises about 0.6% of the world population, and (I may have done this math wrong) less than 0.1% of world GDP (GWP). So, even if NZ transformed overnight into a 100% sustainably electrically powered, vegetarian based society - how much would it help the planet?

People keep making these kinds of arguments. They are based on faulty logic and I find it incredible that those making them can't seem to see this.

1. The plastic bag argument. Of course this won't make a meaningful difference, though it may spare a whale or two a bad tummy ache. But that is not the point. The point is that it makes a gesture and illustrates a point of principle. It says that a turning point has been reached and change - however small- is being made. It says that the issue is being taken seriously and at least some people care about it. It is SYMBOLIC. Think of it as a first class passenger offering a deck chair to a third class one. It won't stop the ship from sinking but it might make the survivors think a little about helping their fellow human.

2. We are such a small part of the problem that whatever we do won't make a difference so why bother doing anything? Again, someone has to go first. It has symbolic value, but also more than just that. It sets an example and shames those who refuse to put their drinks down and leave the bar, in spite of the ship's tilt.

That's taking it out of context. He said he's doing his bit but is unsure if it will be enough.

paulchinnz

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#2384396 2-Jan-2020 21:44

Tinkerisk:

NOT visiting NZ/AUS with the whole family for vacances despite the massive advertisments and offers here in radio and TV broadcasts. Sorry guys and Happy New Year! ;-)

This. Carbon emissions from 1 person's return trip for NZ to Northern Hemisphere is greater than 20000 km of driving petrol at 5L/100km. Good on ya @tinkerisk

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#2384461 2-Jan-2020 23:50

paulchinnz:
Tinkerisk:

NOT visiting NZ/AUS with the whole family for vacances despite the massive advertisments and offers here in radio and TV broadcasts. Sorry guys and Happy New Year! ;-)

This. Carbon emissions from 1 person's return trip for NZ to Northern Hemisphere is greater than 20000 km of driving petrol at 5L/100km. Good on ya @tinkerisk

I recall someone argue that air travel is less polluting because co2 emission per km (per person) is lower than driving. I had no response. Because math.

kingdragonfly

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#2384536 3-Jan-2020 11:19

I don't completely support these people. They tend oppose a lot, but very few put in the long hard slog of engaging with the opposition constructively, making suggestions that eventually make nation-wide changes.

In my 20's I hung out with ultra-left wing USA protesters, just shy of being labeled a terrorist. I've been threatened with counter-protesters armed with shotguns. I remember an organizer for a radical organization telling me it's not enough to get physical and yell abuse. To be effective, you need to look and dress normal, and engage with the opposition, for months, if not years.

At the time, I didn't agree, preferring the quick "in your face" approach, but I've learned she's right. Brief stunts don't change anything.

Behind the Extinction Rebellion climate protests

CNN

Extinction Rebellion's meteoric rise has left many people -- including some of its founders -- wondering how they managed it, and whether the movement can maintain the momentum

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