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tdgeek
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  #2671385 11-Mar-2021 06:42
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Scott3:

 

 

 

We have 60,000+ doses turning up a week, but are only dispensing 3,000 odd a week.

 

Our rapidly growing stock is in the area of 250,000 doses...

 

Some degree of stockpiling is justified:

 

  • We want to ensure that 2nd doses are available for the likes of border workers and their families when they come due. (Including in the event of a supply crunch, such as the the origin country banning vaccine exports)
  • We don't want to cause massive frustration where the vaccination people need to cancel heaps of appointments etc, and sit around (likely on full pay) because we have run out our stocks.

But is seems we already have heaps of vaccine in the ultra cold freezers to meet the above. As such we should be Running our vaccination program at roughly the same rate as doses come in, or even a touch faster to run down our stock to the target level.

 

Excess stock in storage, along with meaning out community isn't getting protection from it's use, also runs an (admittedly small risk) of being damaged, sabotaged, stolen etc. (freezer failure would be the most likely risk).

 

 

The schedule MF posted seems fine. Its starting, plus the scattered border workers aren't the same as saturating  school and mass vaccinating in one place. Border workers are scattered everywhere and they cannot all assemble in one place. Im ok with it. We aren't battling outbreaks every week here despite bringing back over 100,000 residents, we have time to play with. I hope doctors surgeries are a major front line for vaccines. 




sbiddle
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  #2671396 11-Mar-2021 07:22
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cruxis:

 

There should No need for handing over any personal details as well.

 

 

Providing personal details is a prerequisite for pretty much any medical treatment in NZ. You need to consent to the vaccination which means providing details for that to occur, and these will be stored on the new NIS system along with all your other immunisation and vaccination details.

 

What is the issue? And why would you not do this?

 

 


sbiddle
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  #2671401 11-Mar-2021 07:34
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I'm still interested to know why we're going to be able to vaccinate the first 2 million people before 30th June (and with only 18,000 done that's a lot to go in the next 3 1/2 months) and yet it'll then take another 6 months to vaccinate the remaining two million people.

 

With Pfizer clearly ramping up production, supply presumably is no longer an issue. For many people the easier it is for people to get a vaccine, the better our rollout is likely to be. If the rollout drags on you face the real risk that people simply won't bother getting vaccinated if they look at the rest of the world in say 4-5 months time and semi normality exists. It gives those with vaccine hesitancy yet another reason not to bother.

 

 

 

tdgeek:

 

We aren't battling outbreaks every week here despite bringing back over 100,000 residents, we have time to play with. I hope doctors surgeries are a major front line for vaccines. 

 

 

The fact we don't have major breakouts and have an elimination policy is exactly why we shouldn't be wasting time with our rollout. If our strategy continues to be so risk adverse that we're going to continue lockdowns for the remainder of the year because we don't trust our contact tracing then it's going to be a long 2021.

 

Surely mass vaccination centres which make it easy for people (and more importantly whole groups of people such as an entire family) to all go at once at a time that suits them such as evenings or weekends are far more preferable to somebody having to make an individual booking at their local GP which could be an effort to get to during normal hours.

 

GP's will play an important role when it comes to encouraging those who may be vaccine hesitant (one on one time allows a GP to speak to somebody who make have second thoughts) but in terms of getting jabs in arms they're a pretty inefficient model. Just look at the stats and influenza rollout last year. Most GP clinics simply aren't suitable for rolling out hundreds of vaccines per day particularly with observation period requirements, whereas dedicated facilities can easily be scaled up to handle hundreds of people per day.

 

 

 

 

 

 




tdgeek
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  #2671403 11-Mar-2021 07:50
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Has the mass rollout started? I don't think so. How many doctor surgeries in NZ? Given the most people are registered, then they can start rolling it out in each surgery. Not many per day, but there are many surgeries in NZ. I don't want to go to a vaccination centre and wait for 3 hours, if I'm eligible ill go to the doctor as an extra visit or next time I go. Universities, large workplaces, go there and tidy them up. Large vaccination centres will do a large role, but you need to spread the net far and wide to get numbers per day. Chemists? Not a big thing but get them on board, they also reduce the lines at vaccination centres so those centres can do more jabs.

 

 Flu rollout? True, but that's not a biggie for many, Covid is


Fred99
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  #2671407 11-Mar-2021 08:24
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GP clinics shouldn't be main vaccination centres IMO.  If they're having to prioritise resources for vaccination for six months, then A&E at main hospitals and 24 hour centres will be overwhelmed. 


  #2671408 11-Mar-2021 08:25
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tdgeek:

 

I hope doctors surgeries are a major front line for vaccines. 

 

 

Probably largely not - I guess we'll get more details in a few weeks.
It's just coming up to the beginning of the really busy season for GPs, with winter ailments and flu injections to be managed. They're already complaining of overload & burn-out, and I'd not think that piling the Covid vaccination programme on top would be either a help to them or well received. They and their staff would also have to go through a training / induction process specific to this vaccine.

 

I would hope that there will be a system of Covid vaccination centres - like the one we've seen in South Auckland - for major urban areas and provincial centres, and mobile vaccination teams for rural areas


tdgeek
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  #2671409 11-Mar-2021 08:29
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Fred99:

 

GP clinics shouldn't be main vaccination centres IMO.  If they're having to prioritise resources for vaccination for six months, then A&E at main hospitals and 24 hour centres will be overwhelmed. 

 

 

I didnt say the main source. Do we want 5000 lining up at a centre or 40 lining up at scattered surgeries around the city? More jabs per minute at the latter


 
 
 

Trade NZ and US shares and funds with Sharesies (affiliate link).
tdgeek
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  #2671410 11-Mar-2021 08:32
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PolicyGuy:

 

 

 

Probably largely not - I guess we'll get more details in a few weeks.
It's just coming up to the beginning of the really busy season for GPs, with winter ailments and flu injections to be managed. They're already complaining of overload & burn-out, and I'd not think that piling the Covid vaccination programme on top would be either a help to them or well received. They and their staff would also have to go through a training / induction process specific to this vaccine.

 

I would hope that there will be a system of Covid vaccination centres - like the one we've seen in South Auckland - for major urban areas and provincial centres, and mobile vaccination teams for rural areas

 

 

How many people go to a doctors surgery every day? Already there, get the jab. Thereby leaving vaccination centres free of those people, allowing others to get a jab simultaneously. Youve just increased the jabs per day


tdgeek
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  #2671413 11-Mar-2021 08:38
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More pressure to forego MIQ in favour of a travel bubble. It must be no risk now I assume.

 

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2021/03/duncan-garner-be-kind-jacinda-ardern-let-the-australians-in-this-winter-to-save-our-businesses.html


sbiddle
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  #2671421 11-Mar-2021 08:49
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One other issue that's going to be really interesting in the coming months is also the influenza rollout. The rollout of this has been pushed back slightly this year so we are now looking at the rollout of Covid and influenza vaccines to hundreds of thousands of high risk people within ~2 months and also managing these as these can't be given within two weeks of each other.

 

Considering the large number of people that fit into the high risk category this really seems like it's just going to be a logistical nightmare!

 

 

 

 


Oblivian
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  #2671426 11-Mar-2021 08:56
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With any luck (there goes that word again), flu will go into the single digits again with less importation of it, and less of it overseas

Fred99
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  #2671428 11-Mar-2021 09:00
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tdgeek:

 

How many people go to a doctors surgery every day? Already there, get the jab. Thereby leaving vaccination centres free of those people, allowing others to get a jab simultaneously. Youve just increased the jabs per day

 

 

Sure, but they shouldn't be the primary provider.

 

I can't remember how polio oral vaccine rollout was organised, but I can clearly remember being loaded in the car with my siblings and taken to the local plunket rooms, lined up with other kids and given the (oral) vaccine. Presumably some kind of records were maintained using pen and paper.
They rolled out TB vaccine at schools as a two stage process, line up all the (third form)  kids, administer Heaf test, line them up again and screen for degree of reaction a week later and either vaccinate or send kids who'd reacted for a chest x-ray.  That's a far more complex and skilled process than giving a couple of jabs.

 

I usually get a flu shot at the pharmacy in my local supermarket, my SO gets a free one at work.

 

 


sbiddle
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  #2671430 11-Mar-2021 09:03
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tdgeek:

 

More pressure to forego MIQ in favour of a travel bubble. It must be no risk now I assume.

 

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2021/03/duncan-garner-be-kind-jacinda-ardern-let-the-australians-in-this-winter-to-save-our-businesses.html

 

 

What's your definition of "risk"?

 

It's been 242 days since a case in ACT, 220 days since a case in NT, 210 days since a case in TAS, 76 days without a case in SA, 57 days without a case in QLD, 52 days without a case in NSW, 37 days without a case in WA (who prior to that went 10 months without a case)  and 12 days without a case in VIC.

 

With the exception of VIC every single one of the other states have has longer periods of zero cases than Auckland. We allow people from Auckland to travel to Wellington without going through MIQ, why don't we allow somebody from ACT to visit Wellington without going through MIQ? From a pure probability and risk perspective the chance of them having Covid from is significantly lower than somebody from Auckland.

 

A full bubble is politics from both countries. It's nothing to do with risk.

 

 

 

 

 

 


tdgeek
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  #2671438 11-Mar-2021 09:14
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sbiddle:

 

tdgeek:

 

More pressure to forego MIQ in favour of a travel bubble. It must be no risk now I assume.

 

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2021/03/duncan-garner-be-kind-jacinda-ardern-let-the-australians-in-this-winter-to-save-our-businesses.html

 

 

What's your definition of "risk"?

 

It's been 242 days since a case in ACT, 220 days since a case in NT, 210 days since a case in TAS, 76 days without a case in SA, 57 days without a case in QLD, 52 days without a case in NSW, 37 days without a case in WA (who prior to that went 10 months without a case)  and 12 days without a case in VIC.

 

With the exception of VIC every single one of the other states have has longer periods of zero cases than Auckland. We allow people from Auckland to travel to Wellington without going through MIQ, why don't we allow somebody from ACT to visit Wellington without going through MIQ? From a pure probability and risk perspective the chance of them having Covid from is significantly lower than somebody from Auckland.

 

A full bubble is politics from both countries. It's nothing to do with risk.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Fair enough. if there was the two way bubble and we got a CT case from AUS the world will end. Govt gets criticised as no bubble and criticised if it leaks


tdgeek
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  #2671442 11-Mar-2021 09:21
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Fred99:

 

Sure, but they shouldn't be the primary provider.

 

I can't remember how polio oral vaccine rollout was organised, but I can clearly remember being loaded in the car with my siblings and taken to the local plunket rooms, lined up with other kids and given the (oral) vaccine. Presumably some kind of records were maintained using pen and paper.
They rolled out TB vaccine at schools as a two stage process, line up all the (third form)  kids, administer Heaf test, line them up again and screen for degree of reaction a week later and either vaccinate or send kids who'd reacted for a chest x-ray.  That's a far more complex and skilled process than giving a couple of jabs.

 

I usually get a flu shot at the pharmacy in my local supermarket, my SO gets a free one at work.

 

 

 

 

Again, I don't mean the main source, we need to cast the net far and wide if we want numbers done. 50 surgeries can jab 50 at once. Its a great source to chip away day in and day out. 

 

I was thinking earlier about a polling stint. if stocks and distribtuon allowed it, people can register at a "polling station" same as we use in the elections. Turn up as we do in the elections, jab, wait for 20 minutes. Basically a much much larger network of smaller vaccine centres to take care of a one weekend boost. Like surgeries they wont be jabbing thousands in a day, but a widespread network of polling stations would be a big hit


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